Two Maulings in One Day - Paxman AND Channel 4

[ahinton]

Well if you are in the heart of Hereford or to the South, he's ex Barclays

I know that! - and yes, although I am to the west rather than in the heart or to the south of Hereford, Dr Jesse Norman is indeed my MP, though he's not been with Barclays for some years and was in any case demonstrably uninvolved in the kinds of activity for which it and other banks are now being vilified!

I was going to advise you to move to Wyre Forest. The Independent there was one of the few saints but, while being so, he was unceremoniously kicked out which says a lot about values among voters.

I have not the slightest desire
To move to the forest of Wyre,
For when I eventually go
It will be to a place near Bordeaux.

[Lateralthinking1]

I have not the slightest desire
To move to the forest of Wyre,
For when I eventually go
It will be to a place near Bordeaux.

Don't tell me. It's the lure of socialism with the region's president Segolene Royal.

(It isn't quiet as you remember it - it's crawling with media)

[LHC]

Ah - well, not to worry, then, as one of the pieces of data that I'd liked to have checked is where my own MP stands in such a table, but that will not be possible from your source as he was not elected until the last General Election. I do know that he was once falsely accused of claiming a small expense of some £1,200 or so for his constituency office and successfully challenged it as an expense which had been properly declared and approved.

You could try looking your MP up on this site:

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mps/

You should be able to see their published expenses, voting record and attendance record in the house.

[Flosshilde]

I was going to advise you to move to Wyre Forest. The Independent there was one of the few saints but, while being so, he was unceremoniously kicked out which says a lot about values among voters.

That might have been less to do with his sainthood & more to do with the fact that he couldn't actually have much impact (one of the problems with being an 'Independent'), especially on the issue that he was elected on, the closure of local hospitals. Martin Bell was in a similar position. Such people get elected as a protest, which is unlikely to carry on to a second election.

[handsomefortune]

(soz if this has already been posted and i didn't notice)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jun/29/chloe-smith-mouse-feminist-tory

[scottycelt]

(soz if this has already been posted and i didn't notice)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...-feminist-tory

'Smith, who looks like a Goth pixie ... '

Sexist feminist so-and-so ... what relevance has a woman's looks?.

[Flosshilde]

If you read Tanya Gould's columns regularly you would know her style, & that her feminism is pretty solid & she doesn't hold any brief for women who claim to be 'feminists' yet don't do anything to help women - which, if you read beyond the words quoted, includes women in the Tory party.

[Lateralthinking1]

(soz if this has already been posted and i didn't notice)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...-feminist-tory

Weird article. I don't think many people have suggested that all women in Parliament are feminists or that Paxman has been especially tough on women. The main point about having more women MPs is the need for diversity in Parliament. And as most have commented, Cameron and Osborne are the culprits in the demolition of Chloe Smith rather than Paxman.

It might be that the writer feels that as an MP Smith deserved no sympathy. The inference is one that is as old as the hills -
'we women can be as tough as you men'. While that may be true, you can substitute the word 'ignorant' for 'tough' for there is a lazy and wrong stereotyping of men in that stance and also a lazy and wrong stereotyping of toughness.

Toughness isn't really helpful in politics, or indeed banking, whichever gender displays it. It tends to be little more than a veneer and emanates from nothing of substance. Strength is quite a different matter. It never does 'calm down dear' or 'she looks like a goth pixie' and rarely, when in the wrong, 'I refuse to resign'. There is information about the latter in good history books.

Smith deserved some sympathy not because she is a 'girl' but because of her inexperience. And the average life of a dolphin is not 30 years but 25 although one lived to 56. All in all, this was The Guardian filling up a bit of space with absolute tripe.

[scottycelt]

If you read Tanya Gould's columns regularly you would know her style, & that her feminism is pretty solid & she doesn't hold any brief for women who claim to be 'feminists' yet don't do anything to help women - which, if you read beyond the words quoted, includes women in the Tory party.

I'm not interested in feminism ... it's downright sexist and overtly political.

Gould's bitter and nasty article only confirms that view, and she, most obviously, has only a desire to 'help' women with similar views to herself.

[Flosshilde]

I'm not interested in feminism

That's been abundantly clear for some time

it's downright sexist and overtly political

Feeling a bit insecure?

[scottycelt]

That's been abundantly clear for some time





Feeling a bit insecure?

a) I hope so, Floss ... clarity and consistency must be the goal at all times however much that may irritate valued disapproving members here!

b) Not particularly, though I'd feel rather more happy and secure in my infamously tiny little mind if you were to actually address the points made.

[Flosshilde]

which were?

[french frank]

It might be that the writer feels that as an MP Smith deserved no sympathy.

I think it's more that she feels that as a Tory Smith deserves no sympathy.

[Flosshilde]

I think point Tanya Gould is making (or trying to make) is that Tories don't like women, & any pretence that Tory women make to being feminists is undermined by the hostility of the Party -

One "supportive" colleague compared Smith to a "tiny mouse"; another said that whoever put her in front of a TV camera again after she blathered during Channel 4 News "should be taken out and shot"; yet another pointed out that Smith's boss, Osborne, was at a dinner party during the broadcast, and this was an act of terrible moral cowardice.

... watching the Tories eat their females, apparently in revenge for some positive discrimination, is becoming a sport. There have been similar briefings against Lady Warsi, sometimes so loud that the mere memory of her is a panic attack in shoes. But who can be surprised? This is government by clique, and the function of a clique is to isolate everyone beyond it. Sometimes it is a nation, and sometimes it is only a woman.

and also by their own actions -

Smith may have been unable to slap Paxman for his interruptions, but she is able to vote for all sorts of legislation that harms women, and she does.


My view of women in the Tory party is the same as my view of gays in the Tory party - why?

[Lateralthinking1]

I think it's more that she feels that as a Tory Smith deserves no sympathy.

That might be true. One question might be 'how do male Tory MPs behave towards other male Tory MPs?'. I have two images:

1. They club together and defend each other come what may, particularly when under attack
2. They are immensely competitive and behind all the niceties are constantly at war with each other

The next questions might be the same only with reference to Labour and the Liberal Democrats.