Robin Gibb

[cloughie]

Sad to see him go - his talents and achievements over the years have probably been undervalued.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-18140862

[VodkaDilc]

Sad to see him go - his talents and achievements over the years have probably been undervalued.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-18140862

Agreed that he was an important figure, but the quote I heard from Paul Gambaccini on R4 this morning did strike me as somewhat ridiculous. Cloughie's link above confirms that I did not mis-hear:

Broadcaster Paul Gambaccini described the singer as "one of the major figures in the history of British music".

Of course, more and more these days "British music" means "British pop music", especially in the daily papers. (Or does he really rank alongside Elgar and Purcell?)

[anotherbob]

Agreed that he was an important figure, but the quote I heard from Paul Gambaccini on R4 this morning did strike me as somewhat ridiculous. Cloughie's link above confirms that I did not mis-hear:

Broadcaster Paul Gambaccini described the singer as "one of the major figures in the history of British music".

Of course, more and more these days "British music" means "British pop music", especially in the daily papers. (Or does he really rank alongside Elgar and Purcell?)

Perhaps considering the number of people the music of the Bee Gees has reached Gambacini's view might not be an unreasonable one, regardless of what you might think of that music? (And British Music must surely include British Pop Music.)
At certain times in my life the Bee Gees meant much more to me than Elgar or Purcell

[ahinton]

Perhaps considering the number of people the music of the Bee Gees has reached Gambacini's view might not be an unreasonable one, regardless of what you might think of that music? (And British Music must surely include British Pop Music.)
At certain times in my life the Bee Gees meant much more to me than Elgar or Purcell

OK, but then you'd surely not expect this to work or to be gotten away with in the opposite direction, would you? Whilst it is far from easy to define and identify what can realistically be called "British music", any attempt to do so must surely recognise that it needs to include all music produced by British musicians?

[BBMmk2]

WEll he was a major artist that stayed at the top for over 25 years and deserves to be recognised alngside side other genres. I know that our beloved classical music does seem to be overlooked these days by certain organisations, media etc, but for someone of his calibre, thisnis no mean feat.

RIP Robin Gibb

[Norfolk Born]

OK, but then you'd surely not expect this to work or to be gotten away with in the opposite direction, would you? Whilst it is far from easy to define and identify what can realistically be called "British music", any attempt to do so must surely recognise that it needs to include all music produced by British musicians?

Interesting to compare this with the BBC News website's description of Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau as a 'respected German baritone'.

[Beef Oven]

Sad to see him go - his talents and achievements over the years have probably been undervalued.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-18140862

Agreed. Sad. Another one gone. Undervalued for sure (although like Donna Summer, not my cup of tea). R.I.P.

[Beef Oven]

Agreed that he was an important figure, but the quote I heard from Paul Gambaccini on R4 this morning did strike me as somewhat ridiculous. Cloughie's link above confirms that I did not mis-hear:

Broadcaster Paul Gambaccini described the singer as "one of the major figures in the history of British music".

Of course, more and more these days "British music" means "British pop music", especially in the daily papers. (Or does he really rank alongside Elgar and Purcell?)

Come on Vodka, don't be naive. 'British music' means pop/rock and miscellany in near orbit. 'Classiscal music', or whatever the name of the music we love in this blog is, has not appeared in the poular media's ken for a good 50 years. We are virtually esoteric by comparison. In another 50 years time, a chat room like this one won't exist.

[amateur51]

Interesting to compare this with the BBC News website's description of Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau as a 'respected German baritone'.

This message has reminded me that D F-D was always referred to by staff at Henry Stave Records in the late 1970s around the time of "Saturday Night Fever" as "Eddie Fisher-Disco"

[Serial_Apologist]

This message has reminded me that D F-D was always referred to by staff at Henry Stave Records in the late 1970s around the time of "Saturday Night Fever" as "Eddie Fisher-Disco"

That was quite widespread, ams. I always preferred Eddie Fisher-Discus - you could throw him up.

[amateur51]

That was quite widespread, ams. I always preferred Eddie Fisher-Discus - you could throw him up.

The wonderful Orchesography overstock LP shop on Cecil Court in London stocked for a while the DF-D/Bernstein Mahler Songs recording. As he was taking your money the owner would advise you that if you played a certain track on 45 rpm, FiDi became a rather marvellous soprano - and it was true!

[Beef Oven]

The wonderful Orchesography overstock LP shop on Cecil Court in London stocked for a while the DF-D/Bernstein Mahler Songs recording. As he was taking your money the owner would advise you that if you played a certain track on 45 rpm, FiDi became a rather marvellous soprano - and it was true!

Ah the fun that could be had by playing records at the wrong speeds! These times are lost to us forever! Playing a Bee Gees 45 at 33 rpm turned them into gorgeous castratos!

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

aah well poor Mr Gibb was oft accused of singing at the wrong rpm [falsetto] along with his brothers ...

a measure of their writing talent and producing talent is the large number of very catchy ear worms they wrote/produced for others ... as well as their own bee Gee brand ..

"Ain't Nothing Gonna Keep Me From You" by Teri DeSario
"Buried Treasure" by Kenny Rogers (backing vocals The Gatlin Brothers)
"Chain Reaction" by Diana Ross
"Come on Over" by Olivia Newton-John
"Emotion" by Samantha Sang and by Destiny's Child
"Gilbert Green" by Gerry Marsden
"Grease" by Frankie Valli
"Guilty" and "Woman in Love" by Barbra Streisand
"Heartbreaker" & "All the Love in the World" by Dionne Warwick
"Hold On to My Love" by Jimmy Ruffin
"I Will Be There" by Tina Turner
"If I Can't Have You" by Yvonne Elliman
"Immortality" by Celine Dion
"Islands in the Stream" by Kenny Rogers and Dolly Parton
"Morning of My Life" by Abi and Esther Ofarim and by Mary Hopkin
"Only One Woman" by The Marbles
"Rest Your Love on Me" by Conway Twitty
"Sacred Trust" by One True Voice
"Warm Ride" by Graham Bonnet and by Rare Earth
wicki

[Lateralthinking1]

Sad news about Robin today. The Bee Gees were never offensive. For decades, inoffensiveness in pop music was considered an indictment. Now offensiveness has become such a significant part of the etiquette, it is entirely conservative. The obvious pivotal point was 1977. "Saturday Night Fever" arrived more than a decade after the Gibb Brothers' first recordings and it took the disco genre even more fully into the mainstream. Back in the sixties they had been distinctly non dance and almost on the borders of rock but they were instantaneously recognisable throughout. It is worth remembering that in those different days we had "Opportunity Knocks" and "New Faces" rather than "X Factor". Such programmes were the favourites of grandparents. Not saddled by all of the modern television hype, youngish superstars often emerged more slowly and organically. They were altogether better times. Clearly, by the late 1970s, Barry, Maurice and Robin were not millionaire apprentices but skilled craftsmen. Being in the charts at the same time as the Sex Pistols, many teenagers saw them as old hat. But as John Lydon, nee Rotten, reclines in his American mansion and we recall the late Malcolm McLaren's ambitions to be the Mayor of London, one wonders if they ever fully dealt with the issue of honesty. The Bee Gees were arguably a tiny bit less manufactured and what you saw was what you got.

That context is important. Both the Clash and, say, Abba were answers to further years of Barclay James Harvest. According to its logo, the punk rock brand was going to overthrow the system. Its raison d'etre was simple. Dancing in fields, taking copious amounts of illegal substances and sporting long hair hadn't been an efficient way of ushering in revolution. What was needed instead was dyed hair, different drugs and swearing on teatime television. To be harsh but real, the only very long-term change it achieved was the requirement that every chart record should have an F word. It was, though, musically innovative for its time. A seemingly crucial, exciting, new sound with a D-I-Y ethic that took a hammer to the prevailing stodge. By contrast, the Bee Gees were just enjoying themselves and giving millions of other people huge pleasure. That was hardly a crime, even if it lacked edge. And while they obviously earned silly amounts of money, they weren't quite in the position of competing with Volvo, nor did they disappear onto Scandinavian islands saying "we want to be alone". They managed to engage on various levels and, blimey, actually functioned. Yes, it all seemed slightly inane at times but then I think we knew that having such a view was a trifle unfair. Not only did they have a remarkable talent but their records would come to feature regularly in Sean Rowley's box of "Guilty Pleasures".



For better and worse, they were then an industry. Long before Bono and Sting, they had realised that the pop business could offer a lifetime of employment. The Beatles had started it but, having imploded in less than a decade, the concept of group still seemed transitory. Who could have believed that any bunch of individuals in the post war era could stay together professionally for 40 odd years? Paul Gambaccini compares Robin with McCartney. Certainly each has sold mind boggling numbers of records and had huge numbers of songs covered by other artists. It is hard not to think of the Bee Gees without also recalling Barbra Streisand, Dionne Warwick and Diana Ross. What is also true is that the members of both the Beatles and the Bee Gees could write a song in the old fashioned sense. They understood shape and structure at the age of 20 whereas someone like Adele might aim towards reaching a similar level when pushing 90. In other respects the picture is more mixed. We can set aside quickly the obvious fact that no one will ever quite have the impact of the Fab Four. A more subtle difference is that the Bee Gees didn't evolve in the public eye as obviously, even if they were capable of innovation. While singles like "Massachussetts" (1967) and "My World" (1972) should be placed in the category "nice but hardly novel", there was the 1969 top ten album "Odessa", considered now by some to have been a ground-breaking masterpiece. As for me 43 years later, I am open minded but remain among those still not wholly convinced.

It proved to be an up and down road. The fifth album "Cucumber Castle" (1970) reached number 57 in the album charts with one of its tracks being covered by Dean Martin and Engelbert Humperdinck. Meanwhile Deep Purple and Black Sabbath were in the Top 5, several light years away from the Bee Gees' falsetto voices. Those were like absolutely no one elses. I guess we could call them original. They weren't always quite for me in truth but it would be a little crass today to dwell on Kenny Everett's take on them. Commercially they worked. There is the date of the original release of "Jive Talkin'". May 1975. It suggests that they were then ahead of the game, seeing that the song was incorporated in "Saturday Night Fever" to fit the times well over two years after being written. There is also some claim to group members having a relative absence of Robbie Williams' style public ego, though there were many internal, private disputes. While the Beatles had all been very distinctive, I doubt I was alone in being unsure which Bee Gee was which early on. One was defined by the public simply as having been the husband of Lulu. Of course two were twins and all were from the same family. This didn't necessarily lend itself to distinct characterisation and arguably, as individuals, it both helped and hindered them. There was one unfortunate incident in a television studio with Clive Anderson when it seemed that the arrogance of fame had started to get to them. It also rather exposed quite understandable elements of competition.



Along with the sadness of Robin's death today is the sadness of the end of an entity. While solo projects were undertaken, not without considerable success, the Bee Gees will always be a plural on record even if they can never again be live. Whether you liked or disliked what they gave to us - and many loved it - the music generally came first. For that reason, any thoughts about who was mainly responsible for writing their songs and arranging them are not necessarily helpful. If we do try to separate them out into components....well, we are told that it was Barry who was the main writer while Robin was arguably the main singer. That I think suffices. Personally, I still like to pretend that the songs of Lennon and McCartney were written as collaborations. We would all be better off if the celebrity scales were scientifically set to a balance of music and fame now. It emerges in the tributes today that Robin did much for charity and was a supporter of the Labour Party. He appears to have been a good guy. Feelings though must especially go out to Barry who at the age of 65 has lost all three of his younger brothers. That must be a very tough thing to have had to face. As it is played today, "Night Fever" still sounds fresh, as do all the other songs from that era, and "You Win Again" comes across as familiarly uplifting and communally driven. One final thing. In this cynical old world, they did prettiness extraordinarily well. "Words", "First of May", "Too Much Heaven" and particularly "How Deep Is Your Love" are among the prettiest songs ever written. In a bizarre way, they of all their records are a rare and even radical legacy. Robin Gibb, thank you and RIP.

[cloughie]

I think I like most of all their first tranche of success with songs such as New York Mining Disaster, Massachusetts, Words and To Love Somebody. They were mostly simple tunes with good harmonies. Whatever happened to the two guys on guitar and drums who made up the original 5 piece Bee Gees?