Pedants' Paradise

[Lat-Literal]

The Mail today reports that Obama after a second round of golf looked "tiresome and in deep thought".

Is there more than one meaning to this word?

[Alain Maréchal]

I need to ask the pedants to consider a matter that has bothered me for many years:

In the works of Miss J. Austen, and others of the period, expressions such as "is not it", "are not we" "shall not we" are written out in full. Is it probable that this is how people of the class she describes spoke, or were they elided (is that the word?) in speech as "isn't it" "aren't we" "shan't we" but not written down thus?

[french frank]

The Mail today reports that Obama after a second round of golf looked "tiresome and in deep thought".

Is there more than one meaning to this word?

I don't think so. If the Mail said that, I expect that's what was meant.

[french frank]

I need to ask the pedants to consider a matter that has bothered me for many years:

In the works of Miss J. Austen, and others of the period, expressions such as "is not it", "are not we" "shall not we" are written out in full. Is it probable that this is how people of the class she describes spoke, or were they elided (is that the word?) in speech as "isn't it" "aren't we" "shan't we" but not written down thus?

Article here.

Conclusion seems to be that (whatever was Miss Austen's practice, and that of her characters) contractions had been common long before her time.

[Lat-Literal]

I don't think so. If the Mail said that, I expect that's what was meant.

I don't know if the writer is American but it was accompanied by a photograph which might suggest that the thinking was combining tired and lonesome. This led to me wondering what the difference is between lonesome (American?) and lonely. I feel that lonesome might mean lonely for someone and in this context the inference could be politically isolated.

[jean]

I need to ask the pedants to consider a matter that has bothered me for many years:

In the works of Miss J. Austen, and others of the period, expressions such as "is not it", "are not we" "shall not we" are written out in full. Is it probable that this is how people of the class she describes spoke, or were they elided (is that the word?) in speech as "isn't it" "aren't we" "shan't we" but not written down thus?

I'm sure the contracted version was what was said, but the convention was to write it in full - just as now it is not common for some contractions - like 'would've' and 'could've' - to appear in print.

What I find curious is that when we want to speak without contractions we do not say 'Is not it?' but always 'Is it not?'

[Serial_Apologist]

I'm sure the contracted version was what was said, but the convention was to write it in full - just as now it is not common for some contractions - like 'would've' and 'could've' - to appear in print.

What I find curious is that when we want to speak without contractions we do not say 'Is not it?' but always 'Is it not?'

Emphasis? If someone says "Isn't it the case that...?" we may be tempted to ask, "Why?", whereas "Is it not the case that...?" suggests assertion that it may well be.

[jean]

I don't think so. If the Mail said that, I expect that's what was meant.

I don't think anyone can look tiresome, even to the Mail! Tiresomeness surely has to be a function of behaviour.

If you google the phrase, you are taken to an article containing 'Obama was captured looking tiresome and in heavy contemplation as ...'

But when you click on to the actual article, you find it's been changed to 'Obama was captured looking tired and in heavy contemplation as...'

So, a mistake, I think.

[Lat-Literal]

I don't think anyone can look tiresome, even to the Mail! Tiresomeness surely has to be a function of behaviour.

If you google the phrase, you are taken to an article containing 'Obama was captured looking tiresome and in heavy contemplation as ...'

But when you click on to the actual article, you find it's been changed to 'Obama was captured looking tired and in heavy contemplation as...'

So, a mistake, I think.

Yes - it has been changed in part!

Perhaps this forum has an audience it didn't know it had.

[ahinton]

I'm sure the contracted version was what was said, but the convention was to write it in full - just as now it is not common for some contractions - like 'would've' and 'could've' - to appear in print.

What I find curious is that when we want to speak without contractions we do not say 'Is not it?' but always 'Is it not?'

Sydney Grew does! - but then that rather proves your point!

[jean]

Emphasis? If someone says "Isn't it the case that...?" we may be tempted to ask, "Why?", whereas "Is it not the case that...?" suggests assertion that it may well be.

I wouldn't disagree that we usually do use the uncontracted form for emphasis - but my point was that we always say (as you write) "Is it not the case that...?" rather than "Is not it the case that...?"

[jean]

Sydney Grew does! - but then that rather proves your point!

You are right on both counts!

[ahinton]

Yes - it has been changed in part!

Perhaps this forum has an audience it didn't know it had.

Or maybe ex-President Obama called the rag to insist that it be changed. Or even perhaps he did so having read references to it on this forum!

[gurnemanz]

Article here.

Conclusion seems to be that (whatever was Miss Austen's practice, and that of her characters) contractions had been common long before her time.

At school were told never (ne'er?) to use contractions in written English. They would be underlined in red. In good pedantic schoolmasterly tradition I carried this on when marking students' essays. I suspect I might be out of step with current practice. Fashions change. Shakespeare uses 'tis, e'er, e'en and many other contractions both in plays and sonnets. Rather than seeming sub-standard, over-informal or lazy it tends to sound poetic and quaint. Also the famous:

I wandered lonely as a cloud
That floats on high o'er vales and hills,

[Lat-Literal]

Or maybe ex-President Obama called the rag to insist that it be changed. Or even perhaps he did so having read references to it on this forum!

Quizas, Quizas, Quizas.

(Spanish/American)