Pedants' Paradise

[smittims]

One Americanism I do like is 'thru' . 'January thru March' is better than 'From the first of January to the 31st of March inclusive' , the only unambiguous way to say it in English.

Oh, and 'gotten' is not an Americanism. You'll find it in Anthony Trollope.

[ardcarp]

Anyone remember Pottlewhistle Halt?

[french frank]

Oh, and 'gotten' is not an Americanism. You'll find it in Anthony Trollope.

An anachronism, then? It can still be an Americanism in that the usage is current US English. It depends on who uses it over here: it could just be a regionalism.

[gurnemanz]

Forgotten, begotten are now standard. Shakespeare makes the cynic, Enobarbus, in Antony and Cleopatra say: "That truth should be silent I had almost forgot." There is ongoing flexibility in past participle usage. Some verbs remain in flux, eg bid or bidden, proved or proven

[Pulcinella]

The Oxford comma: often needed to avoid ambiguity, never wrong, and therefore always worth using (as in this sentence, and in my opinion!).
However, our new Health Secretary has vowed to purge it.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/short-briefings-banned-jargon-and-no-oxford-commas-therese-coffeys-rules-for-department-of-health-staff-xbjzxhk5n?shareToken=3aea5819cd3d8b50f0db3638b5bcc8ab

How refreshing to know that there aren't more important things for her to be worried about.
The hospital waiting lists fall into insignificance in comparison.



(Perhaps this should be on The Grumble Thread.)

[Bryn]

The Oxford comma: often needed to avoid ambiguity, never wrong, and therefore always worth using (as in this sentence, and in my opinion!).
However, our new Health Secretary has vowed to purge it.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/short-briefings-banned-jargon-and-no-oxford-commas-therese-coffeys-rules-for-department-of-health-staff-xbjzxhk5n?shareToken=3aea5819cd3d8b50f0db3638b5bcc8ab

How refreshing to know that there aren't more important things for her to be worried about.
The hospital waiting lists fall into insignificance in comparison.



(Perhaps this should be on The Grumble Thread.)

I wonder what the views of this 'ere King Charles III are, regarding the Oxford comma?

[french frank]

The Oxford comma: often needed to avoid ambiguity, never wrong,

I tend to use more commas than others, though I'm not sure that they're strictly Oxford commas. Writing online does sometimes mean that a comma gets, put randomly in the wrong place. That doesn't often make the sentence confusing though. The well-known example "To my parents, Ayn Rand and God" makes Pulcinella's point. Though in "My mother, Ayn Rand, and HM the Queen" it would need a following explanation to establish whether AR was 'my mother' or one of three women 'I' respect. Wouldn't it?

[Pulcinella]

I tend to use more commas than others, though I'm not sure that they're strictly Oxford commas. Writing online does sometimes mean that a comma gets, put randomly in the wrong place. That doesn't often make the sentence confusing though. The well-known example "To my parents, Ayn Rand and God" makes Pulcinella's point. Though in "My mother, Ayn Rand, and HM the Queen" it would need a following explanation to establish whether AR was 'my mother' or one of three women 'I' respect. Wouldn't it?

Indeed it would: "My mother (Ayn Rand) and the queen" would work quite neatly in one instance.

[oddoneout]

Plenty to tie one in knots here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_comma in "Betty's journey to Oregon".
There are times when perhaps it would be better to scrap a sentence and just start again, possibly with a couple of extra words and/or different word order, to avoid ambiguity. While some ambiguity may be entertaining, other cases can cause problems.

[Pulcinella]

I tend to use more commas than others, though I'm not sure that they're strictly Oxford commas. Writing online does sometimes mean that a comma gets, put randomly in the wrong place. That doesn't often make the sentence confusing though. The well-known example "To my parents, Ayn Rand and God" makes Pulcinella's point. Though in "My mother, Ayn Rand, and HM the Queen" it would need a following explanation to establish whether AR was 'my mother' or one of three women 'I' respect. Wouldn't it?

I think that the Oxford comma refers to the comma before the last item in a list (so often before an 'and', which raises the hackles in the same way that using a so-called split infinitive does for some people).
I tend to use lots of commas too, as I think that they help the sense/readability; often they are before an 'and' or a 'but'.
Here's one such example:
I'm going to the library later, and on my way there I'll be getting my Covid booster.

[cloughie]

I think that the Oxford comma refers to the comma before the last item in a list (so often before an 'and', which raises the hackles in the same way that using a so-called split infinitive does for some people).
I tend to use lots of commas too, as I think that they help the sense/readability; often they are before an 'and' or a 'but'.
Here's one such example:
I'm going to the library later, and on my way there I'll be getting my Covid booster.

That use of a comma is fine, but I think eg ‘I will add to list of pencil, pen, ink, and a blotter’ is not!

[gurnemanz]

I think that the Oxford comma refers to the comma before the last item in a list (so often before an 'and', which raises the hackles in the same way that using a so-called split infinitive does for some people).
I tend to use lots of commas too, as I think that they help the sense/readability; often they are before an 'and' or a 'but'.
Here's one such example:
I'm going to the library later, and on my way there I'll be getting my Covid booster.

I also tend to sprinkle commas liberally, probably overdoing it. Having been a German teacher, I sometimes find myself influenced by German usage, which demands a comma between main clause and subordinate clause. I might find myself writing: "I arrived late, because I missed the train". I believe this is incorrect.

My wife and I have our Covid boost on 26 Sept, our wedding anniversary, at the unlikely venue of the STEAM Museum in Swindon

[french frank]

I"I arrived late, because I missed the train". I believe this is incorrect.

Yes, I thnk so. Not sure about: Because I missed the train, I arrived late. I might be inclined to use one there.

My wife and I have our Covid boost on 26 Sept, our wedding anniversary, at the unlikely venue of the STEAM Museum in Swindon

Thank you for sharing; I had my seasonal booster yesterday, at a local pharmacy about 30 mins walk from where I live.

[Pulcinella]

I also tend to sprinkle commas liberally, probably overdoing it. Having been a German teacher, I sometimes find myself influenced by German usage, which demands a comma between main clause and subordinate clause. I might find myself writing: "I arrived late, because I missed the train". I believe this is incorrect.

My wife and I have our Covid boost on 26 Sept, our wedding anniversary, at the unlikely venue of the STEAM Museum in Swindon

Not wrong in my book: depends on the emphasis you want to give to the reason for being late.
Subtle distinction, perhaps, but there for me.

I went to bed early because I was tired. (Even there, I'd tend to use a comma!)
I went to bed early, because I knew that I had a long and stressful day ahead of me.

[french frank]

I went to bed early because I was tired. (Even there, I'd tend to use a comma!)
I went to bed early, because I knew that I had a long and stressful day ahead of me.

I'd certainly agree in the second case. In the first, you may do so if you wish but, in my view, you add more than emphasis. The momentary pause implies that someone has questioned why you did so; or perhaps that you think someone might be wondering about it and require an explanation.