Pedants' Paradise

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

... and that 'last', 'fast', 'path', 'bath', etc. have long 'a's!

Who says? Southerners? Many of them become confused and get it wrong even according their own rules. E.g. Elastoplarst/Elarstoplast.

[Nick Armstrong]

Be reasonable, who drinks Moët when The Widow is available? :whistle;

Did I suggest a preference....?

Apart from anything else, it makes saying "Moët et Chandon" much more euphonious (no unpleasant "eh eh" in the middle).

... as in, for instance: "If you bring another bottle of Moët et Chandon into this house, Blenkinsop, I'll have you horse-whipped"

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

On today's BaL, we had a review of available versions of Chopin's Ballards.

[french frank]

On today's BaL, we had a review of available versions of Chopin's Ballards.

Load of bollards!

[french frank]

Apart from anything else, it makes saying "Moët et Chandon" much more euphonious (no unpleasant "eh eh" in the middle).

Wikipedia says: "The Moët family can trace its origins to a Dutch soldier named LeClerc who fought alongside Joan of Arc in fending off English attempts at preventing the crowning of Charles VII. As a reward for his service, the King changed his name to Moët."

I'm assuming the King didn't change his own name to Moët (did he?), but why would he change someone else's name to Moët as a reward for his services?

[vinteuil]

... I think Moët is a most unlikely Dutch name.

Where do we stand on Perrier-Jouët ?

I think joo-ett as in mo-ett...

[Bryn]

Mr Humphrys must be bright crimson with apoplexy. A supposedly authoritative commentator on matters royal and the sharing of regal duties between Brenda and fils just referred to "Governor Generals" on the Today Programme. How dare he so mangle the Queen's English?! It's "Governors General", you numpty.

[mercia]

yes, is there a rule about that one ? e.g. would it be Rears Admiral ?

[Bryn]

yes, is there a rule about that one ? e.g. would it be Rears Admiral ?

Yes, and no. The point is that a Governor General is a governor with general powers, not a general who governs. In the case of rear admiral, he of she is an admiral, not a rear. The "General" and "Rear" play the adjectival role.

[mercia]

I see. Flights Lieutenant ? Lieutenants Colonel ?

[amateur51]

... I think Moët is a most unlikely Dutch name.

Where do we stand on Perrier-Jouët ?

I think joo-ett as in mo-ett...

I thought that we pronounced the 't' in Moët because it runs into 'et', whereas the 't' in Jouët does not

[Serial_Apologist]

Francois Hollaunde???

One hears this all the time on radio and TV - I would have thought that BBC reporters could prounce the name - it's not that difficult, surely?

[french frank]

Francois Hollaunde???

One hears this all the time on radio and TV - I would have thought that BBC reporters could prounce the name - it's not that difficult, surely?

That is extremely interesting!!!!! It corresponds with the medieval anglo-norman pronunciation which differed from 'standard' French. That's why lancer > launch, pance > paunch, étancher > staunch, (t)ante > aunt, hanche >haunch, hanter >haunt &c &c.

[jean]

...(t)ante > aunt...

Isn't that an odd one out, even in RP?

[french frank]

Isn't that an odd one out, even in RP?

I think the spelling would indicate the earlier pronunciation, but in that the pronunciation has altered, I suppose it is the odd one out. amita> ante > aunt, with modern French duplicating the 't' sound.

And John of Gaunt originally 'Ghent', if I remember correctly. All of these examples have an 'n' present indicating the French and English variations in representing the nasalised vowel sound.