Pedants' Paradise

[Bryn]

... if I recall the Greeks thought that the kingfisher made its nest / laid its eggs on the ocean wave - and the preternaturally calm weather required for this was named after the bird

https://www.birdguides.com/articles/halcyon-days/

How very parochial of the ancient Greeks, for do not the majority of species of 'kingfisher' live their lives quite unassociated with either watercourses or the sea?

[french frank]

How very parochial of the ancient Greeks, for do not the majority of species of 'kingfisher' live their lives quite unassociated with either watercourses or the sea?

OED says that ἀλκυών was 'A mythical bird, identified by the ancients with the kingisher'. This seems to suggest that it was not so identified by the pre-ancients. RSPB says of the kingfisher, contrary to what the right honourable member was enquiring: "Kingfishers inhabit slow-moving, shallow rivers or streams which are clean enough to support abundant small fish." Not seashores, seas or oceans, though, apparently.

[oddoneout]

OED says that ἀλκυών was 'A mythical bird, identified by the ancients with the kingisher'. This seems to suggest that it was not so identified by the pre-ancients. RSPB says of the kingfisher, contrary to what the right honourable member was enquiring: "Kingfishers inhabit slow-moving, shallow rivers or streams which are clean enough to support abundant small fish." Not seashores, seas or oceans, though, apparently.

Wouldn't that make them "kingfishes" rather than kingfishers...?

[Bryn]

OED says that ἀλκυών was 'A mythical bird, identified by the ancients with the kingisher'. This seems to suggest that it was not so identified by the pre-ancients. RSPB says of the kingfisher, contrary to what the right honourable member was enquiring: "Kingfishers inhabit slow-moving, shallow rivers or streams which are clean enough to support abundant small fish." Not seashores, seas or oceans, though, apparently.

That, however, refers to the bird we in the UK know as the kingfisher. It's relatives around the world are more often found away from water:

https://www.surfbirds.com/Features/kingfishers.html

[french frank]

Just wondering, isn't a comma required after 'Clinton'?

"Watson has led the UN’s scientific organisations for climate and biodiversity, is a former chief scientific adviser at the UK’s environment department and worked for Bill Clinton when he was US president."

[Bryn]

Just wondering, isn't a comma required after 'Clinton'?

"Watson has led the UN’s scientific organisations for climate and biodiversity, is a former chief scientific adviser at the UK’s environment department and worked for Bill Clinton when he was US president."

To me, that would suggest Watson had been president.

[french frank]

To me, that would suggest Watson had been president.

That's why I asked. To me, the comma creates a pause after Clinton, and taking up the sentence again what follows refers to Clinton, the last mentioned. I read the sentence first as applying to Watson. Not sure of the rule here. Vinty?

OR

"Clinton has led the UN’s scientific organisations for climate and biodiversity, is a former chief scientific adviser at the UK’s environment department and worked for the UN when he was US president."

[oddoneout]

To me, that would suggest Watson had been president.

And to me, but such a use of the comma, to clarify, doesn't seem to be considered all that necessary these days. Tiresome, and open to misinterpretation in some case perhaps? Then again perhaps enough people "know what was meant" for it not to be considered a problem.

[oddoneout]

Gwyneth Paltrow has been urged to stop spreading misinformation by the medical director of NHS England

Perhaps I'm being unduly picky, but isn't the source of misinformation GP rather than the medical director? Just a simple rearrangement would make this so much clearer, but I suppose the ambiguity is masked by "everyone" knowing that GP peddles some odd ideas and so would interpret the words the correct way despite the way they have been assembled.

[Serial_Apologist]

Perhaps I'm being unduly picky, but isn't the source of misinformation GP rather than the medical director? Just a simple rearrangement would make this so much clearer, but I suppose the ambiguity is masked by "everyone" knowing that GP peddles some odd ideas and so would interpret the words the correct way despite the way they have been assembled.

Switching the sentence around so that it read, "Gwyneth Paltrow has been urged by the medical director of NHS England to stop spreading misinformation", might have avoided the erroneous mis-attribution!

[oddoneout]

Switching the sentence around so that it read, "Gwyneth Paltrow has been urged by the medical director of NHS England to stop spreading misinformation", might have avoided the erroneous mis-attribution!

That was my thought, it's the same words, doesn't make the sentence any longer, so no reason not to.

[LeMartinPecheur]

This from Tom Peck in the Independent today:

"Nicola Sturgeon makes no secret of the fact that her taking up of the independence cause was driven by the events of the 1980s, when she was angry that Scotland was governed by Margaret Thatcher and the Tory party, when they hadn’t and would never vote for her."

To me this means that Thatcher and the Tory party never voted for Nicola Sturgeon. Well, I never thought they did! I'm sure he wants 'they' to link back to 'Scotland' but it doesn't at all, does it? The difference in number is one aspect, but replacing 'they' with 'it' doesn't IMO solve the problem - it surely would still relate back to 'the Tory party'.

Late thought: I wonder if Peck originally wrote 'we' if he's a Scot, and then got edited for a wider readership!

[oddoneout]

This from Tom Peck in the Independent today:

"Nicola Sturgeon makes no secret of the fact that her taking up of the independence cause was driven by the events of the 1980s, when she was angry that Scotland was governed by Margaret Thatcher and the Tory party, when they hadn’t and would never vote for her."

To me this means that Thatcher and the Tory party never voted for Nicola Sturgeon. Well, I never thought they did! I'm sure he wants 'they' to link back to 'Scotland' but it doesn't at all, does it? The difference in number is one aspect, but replacing 'they' with 'it' doesn't IMO solve the problem - it surely would still relate back to 'the Tory party'.

Late thought: I wonder if Peck originally wrote 'we' if he's a Scot, and then got edited for a wider readership!

Clumsy to the point of being meaningless - and if it was seen by an editor then it doesn't say much for that person's abilities in my opinion.

[french frank]

This from Tom Peck in the Independent today:

"Nicola Sturgeon makes no secret of the fact that her taking up of the independence cause was driven by the events of the 1980s, when she was angry that Scotland was governed by Margaret Thatcher and the Tory party, when they hadn’t and would never vote for her."

To me this means that Thatcher and the Tory party never voted for Nicola Sturgeon. Well, I never thought they did! I'm sure he wants 'they' to link back to 'Scotland' but it doesn't at all, does it? The difference in number is one aspect, but replacing 'they' with 'it' doesn't IMO solve the problem - it surely would still relate back to 'the Tory party'.

Late thought: I wonder if Peck originally wrote 'we' if he's a Scot, and then got edited for a wider readership!

Or perhaps remove 'and the Tory party'? "She was angry that Scotland was governed by Margaret Thatcher, when they hadn’t and would never vote for her." Even then the grammar is suspect: 'voted' or 'vote'? Mixed tenses.

[Pulcinella]

Clumsy to the point of being meaningless - and if it was seen by an editor then it doesn't say much for that person's abilities in my opinion.

Clumsy indeed, but 'they' = 'the people of Scotland' is not too bad a substitution in my book.