Pedants' Paradise

[Serial_Apologist]

Guilty as charged - - and agreed, tho if you bing, as opposed to google, it, at the top of the list you get

"a surreal mix of fact and fantasy"
synonyms: zany · madcap · offbeat · quirky · outlandish · eccentric · idiosyncratic · surreal · ridiculous · nonsensical · crazy · absurd · insane · far out · fantastic · bizarre · peculiar · weird · odd · strange · [more] - which seems to sum up Eddie Mair to a T - omitting the essential "dreamlike" element which obviously supports your argument about the weakening of the term.

Though - since you have elevated this to Pedant's Corner, I'd like to point out that I'm a boarder, not a border (herbaceous or otherwise)

[oddoneout]

.
... yes indeed. When I arrived in Paris I noticed that whenever I went to the greengrocer/butcher/baker to buy a lettuce / a nice bit of lamb / a baguette - the instantaneous riposte was " ... et avec cela? ".

Such a simple marketing ploy, odd that we didn't adopt it in these islands....

Ah well, the French - a nation of shopkeepers, as Napoleon meant to say.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation_of_shopkeepers

.

Long history of not being interested in/serious about food? Upselling is a feature elsewhere - extended warranties, additional beauty products, accessories to go with clothing etc.

[kernelbogey]

.... I'd like to point out that I'm a boarder, not a border (herbaceous or otherwise)

[kernelbogey]

According to Freeview (which I happen to be using for Radio 3 just now), and the R3 website, I have just been been listening to Purcell's Chacony in G minor. If this is the spelling of chaconne that Purcell wrote, it's puzzling to know why it's not in OED. Anyone know where this spelling originates? (Perhaps just pedantry by Harry Christophers .)

Edit: it's not in Grove, either, as an entry, although there's a reference to Britten's use of that spelling in his 2nd String Quartet.

[Pabmusic]

According to Freeview (which I happen to be using for Radio 3 just now), and the R3 website, I have just been been listening to Purcell's Chacony in G minor. If this is the spelling of chaconne that Purcell wrote, it's puzzling to know why it's not in OED. Anyone know where this spelling originates? (Perhaps just pedantry by Harry Christophers .)

Edit: it's not in Grove, either, as an entry, although there's a reference to Britten's use of that spelling in his 2nd String Quartet.

The Oxford Companion to Music, 10th edn. includes it as "Old English spelling of chaconne" - which sounds right (there has been a definite tendency to prefer Frenchified spellings over English in the last 300 years).

For what it's worth, my own mock-antique suite Where Once We Danced (1983) includes a Chacony.

Here is a computerised version:

https://m.soundcloud.com/pabmusic-445605675/sets/where-once-we-danced

[french frank]

If this is the spelling of chaconne that Purcell wrote, it's puzzling to know why it's not in OED.

Interesting point. The OED article on 'chaconne' has apparently not been updated since 1889 (the 2º edition didn't update it from what we read at present with all the same quotations). It looks as if Purcell's might have been the earliest appearance in English (hence no 'usual' spelling), possibly predating Dryden's 'chacon' in 1685 by a few years.

[kernelbogey]

Interesting point. The OED article on 'chaconne' has apparently not been updated since 1889 (the 2º edition didn't update it from what we read at present with all the same quotations). It looks as if Purcell's might have been the earliest appearance in English (hence no 'usual' spelling), possibly predating Dryden's 'chacon' in 1685 by a few years.

A closer reading - well, scanning - of the quite long Grove article reveals the sentence The name 'chacony' was used in England during the Baroque period.

It was a 'dance-song' imported from Latin America into Spain (chacona) and Italy (ciaconna).

I would expect OED by now to have search engines which might pick up the chacony spelling from current writings (perhaps including these ).

[kernelbogey]

The Oxford Companion to Music, 10th edn. includes it as "Old English spelling of chaconne" - which sounds right (there has been a definite tendency to prefer Frenchified spellings over English in the last 300 years).

For what it's worth, my own mock-antique suite Where Once We Danced (1983) includes a Chacony.

Here is a computerised version:

https://m.soundcloud.com/pabmusic-44...once-we-danced

Thanks for this Pabs. And I hope you are thriving .

[Pabmusic]

Thanks for this Pabs. And I hope you are thriving .

Yes, thank you. Very well.

[french frank]

I would expect OED by now to have search engines which might pick up the chacony spelling from current writings (perhaps including these ).

I suppose they haven't got round to it. I remember some celeb - can't quite remember who - was an inveterate forwarder to the OED of 'Things Found' which would be useful for updaters - like earliest use of words. Not Germaine Greer. Joan Bakewell? No … Vaguely popular/serious - I think she might be dead now. But anyone else can send in information

https://public.oed.com/history/rewriting-the-oed/

[LMcD]

Leonard Bernstein's 'Kandeed' - why not 'Kondeed'? Perhaps this might turn out to be what a French person would call The Unanswered Kestion.

[french frank]

The comment is possibly somewhat belated, but: the use of 'beyond' as an intensive. Presumably based on such phrases as 'beyond belief' (A is too B to be C as in too incredible to be credible). Is it usually beyond + noun? Beyond repair? Beyond everything? Now beyond + adjective, beyond stupid, beyond awesome &c.

[kernelbogey]

The comment is possibly somewhat belated, but: the use of 'beyond' as an intensive. Presumably based on such phrases as 'beyond belief' (A is too B to be C as in too incredible to be credible). Is it usually beyond + noun? Beyond repair? Beyond everything? Now beyond + adjective, beyond stupid, beyond awesome &c.

Recently, Ivanka Trump 'beyond grateful'. It seeems to be drifting across the Atlantic (aah, it's from beyond!).
[Edit: right thread?]

[LMcD]

'Between...to' instead of 'between ... and'.

[french frank]

Recently, Ivanka Trump 'beyond grateful'. It seeems to be drifting across the Atlantic (aah, it's from beyond!).
[Edit: right thread?]

I think it's the right thread. I wasn't being judgemental over its usage: I'd just noticed it. 'Beyond grateful' is a lovely example.