Pedants' Paradise

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

In an article quoted on another thread, I find the curious but quite widespread half a bitter

There is no such thing as a bitter that you could drink half of. What people are really asking for, whether they realise it or not, is a half of bitter.

I see - so the topic of this post is intended to be the word "pint" (which doesn't appear)? The "of"/"a" swapping (which does, and which you discuss in your reply to MrGG) isn't really the issue?

[jean]

Of course. The 'of/a' swapping, as you call it, depends on the fact that the word 'pint' has been omitted. But I thought you all knew that.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I'm going for a beer.

[french frank]

There is no such thing as a bitter that you could drink half of.

The OED does suggest that bitter n. sg. means "(A glass of) bitter beer. colloq." So 'half a bitter' is a step more colloquial, perhaps one could say? My own taste would be for "A half of heavy, please"

[jean]

One could only say that if it was agreed that the default measurement was a pint.

I think it's too early in the day for a beer. I'm going for a coffee.

[vinteuil]

I get the feeling that Jean's underlying unhappiness here is the (masculinist?) assumption that the default unit measure for a beer should be taken as "a pint".

I'm going for a coffee.

I think we should be told what default unit measure for "a coffee" she is assuming...

[jean]

Caffè normale, of course.

But if I were offered some gross English quantity instead, half a coffee wouldn't get me what I wanted.

[vinteuil]

Caffè normale, of course.

... ta. Mine's a noisette at this time of day.

[jean]

Actually, I too prefer a macchiato around now. I'll go and see to it.

[vinteuil]

[I]

But if I were offered some gross English quantity instead, half a coffee wouldn't get me what I wanted.

... from which we learn, perhaps, that there is not usually a default unit for coffees, but that for some people in some contexts there is a default unit for bitter (and other beers).

[french frank]

I get the feeling that Jean's underlying unhappiness here is the (masculinist?) assumption that the default unit measure for a beer should be taken as "a pint".

Though it is, of course, in this country. And 'a half' (of what unspecified) is assumed to mean half of the default pint.

I think we should be told what default unit measure for "a coffee" she is assuming...

Caffè normale is unknown to me: un café means a usual (demitasse) express (which now seems to have gained an 'o' at the end - while keeping the 'x'?)

[french frank]

Though that reminds me that in one's youth one would enter a bar and ask for 'un demi'. Or 'un demi pression'. It didn't mean half a litre so I've no idea what it was half of.

[vinteuil]

.

... un demi is 25 cl, half of une pinte, 50 cl. At least, in France. Doubtless they have different ideas in Swisserland. Or Belgium...

[Beef Oven!]

And of course Glaswegians can be heard ordering "a litre of heavy" on a daily basis.

[ahinton]

The OED does suggest that bitter n. sg. means "(A glass of) bitter beer. colloq." So 'half a bitter' is a step more colloquial, perhaps one could say? My own taste would be for "A half of heavy, please"

Mine would be for a large G&T or large single malt, though not so large as to constitute a "pint" of either...