Osbornes budget

[Beef Oven]

I think that there is a huge "disconnect" between the rhetoric and reality of these issues. Put simply people like my parents, both retired on pensions , owning a house etc were lucky to be born at the right time, missing having to actually fight in WW2 and living through a period of relatively stable employment and a time when "saving" money DID bring rewards. Today the reality is that no matter how hard one works or how much one saves or acts "prudently" (whatever that means but I guess it means NOT becoming a musician in my case ) the benefits that many (NOT ALL !) people now in their 70's enjoy simply won't be available or affordable. This is , of course, so outside the experience of more or less everyone in the government who have huge stashes of dosh behind them. For politicians to witter on about how we should all save money and "plan" for old age completely ignores the reality for most people. Yesterday I was working with a violinist from one of the big London orchestras, in terms of classical music she is one of the most successful players with work for 6 days most weeks, regardless of how hard she works many of the "ordinary" things that many expect are simply unaffordable (pensions, sick pay etc etc ). SO if it is impossible for someone who is that successful then what about people in more "ordinary" occupations ?

Given camerons pathological lack of empathy with people with disabilities (as his sadly deceased son had !) I can't see any of those in power having a tiny bit of understanding at all..........

Working hard, saving money and being (conventionally) "successful" are no longer a guarantee of anything when you get older ........

'.... a huge "disconnect"....' ???

That's impossible, 'disconnect' is a verb and you wanted a noun!!!

[amateur51]

Actually, what I'm trying to say is that, although there may be exceptional personal circumstances, the monetary loss to those pensioners is not a great deal in terms of what they can buy or what they have to do without. Their pension has gone up in line with prices so they are not worse off.

Didn't the state pension lag behind for many years (decades)?

If you don't have a political body like a trades union to lobby on behalf of your interests, and if you don't have any means of increasing your income, any sort of freeze or reduction will be felt harder than maybe an outsider would think. Most of us don't have to live on the level of the basic state pension until we get there. i live on disability benefits, for which I am most grateful, and it is largely a hand-to-mouth existence compared to that of people who are only marginally better off.

[amateur51]

'.... a huge "disconnect"....' ???

That's impossible, 'disconnect' is a verb and you wanted a noun!!!

Cheeky boy, Beefs!

I agree with what you say, but it's another of these modern usages. What's wrong with 'disconnection' for goodness' sake?

And MrGG did put disconnect in ""s

[MrGongGong]

Cheeky boy, Beefs!

I agree with what you say, but it's another of these modern usages. What's wrong with 'disconnection' for goodness' sake?

And MrGG did put disconnect in ""s

Sorry about that
the nonstop triangle music has affected my Brian
I should have said disconnection

(though at least i'm not up all night in an orgy of prog ........ now there's a cunning way of avoiding Schubert !)

[Simon]

In our society we are not rewarding many people who make a significantly greater contribution than those who think they have a right to be rewarded at the so-called top of the pile.

Yet more common sense! Good to read this.

[Beef Oven]

Sorry about that
the nonstop triangle music has affected my Brian
I should have said disconnection

(though at least i'm not up all night in an orgy of prog ........ now there's a cunning way of avoiding Schubert !)

Since when has The Fall (or Henry Cow for that matter) been prog!!

[eighthobstruction]

Well Peter Cruddas seems to have a different view of 'people who make a significantly greater contribution'....

....gone gone gone quick-sharp....http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17504798

[Beef Oven]

Cheeky boy, Beefs!

I agree with what you say, but it's another of these modern usages. What's wrong with 'disconnection' for goodness' sake?

And MrGG did put disconnect in ""s

Haven't got my reading glasses to hand so I'll just do my best:

1) Disconnection is a lovely word
2) The use of inverted commas made matters worse imo
3) I happen to like modern sausages

Beef Oven

[Beef Oven]

I think that there is a huge "disconnect" between the rhetoric and reality of these issues. Put simply people like my parents, both retired on pensions , owning a house etc were lucky to be born at the right time, missing having to actually fight in WW2 and living through a period of relatively stable employment and a time when "saving" money DID bring rewards. Today the reality is that no matter how hard one works or how much one saves or acts "prudently" (whatever that means but I guess it means NOT becoming a musician in my case ) the benefits that many (NOT ALL !) people now in their 70's enjoy simply won't be available or affordable. This is , of course, so outside the experience of more or less everyone in the government who have huge stashes of dosh behind them. For politicians to witter on about how we should all save money and "plan" for old age completely ignores the reality for most people. Yesterday I was working with a violinist from one of the big London orchestras, in terms of classical music she is one of the most successful players with work for 6 days most weeks, regardless of how hard she works many of the "ordinary" things that many expect are simply unaffordable (pensions, sick pay etc etc ). SO if it is impossible for someone who is that successful then what about people in more "ordinary" occupations ?

Given camerons pathological lack of empathy with people with disabilities (as his sadly deceased son had !) I can't see any of those in power having a tiny bit of understanding at all..........

Working hard, saving money and being (conventionally) "successful" are no longer a guarantee of anything when you get older ........

I agree with what you say and you make the point well. The examples you give are real and quite common. These people get a very raw deal indeed. However, there are hundreds of thousands of people who live their lives without any sense of responsibility for the here and now, or consideration for the future. Unfortunatley, my instincts (and anectdotal observation) tell me that the former are heavily outnumbered by the latter.

[MrGongGong]

Since when has The Fall (or Henry Cow for that matter) been prog!!

Henry Cow are closer to prog (the edge ?) than old misanthropic Marky !
but point taken ............

The whole Schubertfest has got me listening to Rammstein today

[Beef Oven]

Henry Cow are closer to prog (the edge ?) than old misanthropic Marky !
but point taken ............

The whole Schubertfest has got me listening to Rammstein today

Just had to give Du Hast a quick blast with the volume set at 12.00 o'clock!

Might give Schubert's Trout Mask Quintet a spin later (we've gone off topic again - Belgian Frank will dispatch us to some corner of the chat-room!)

[Lateralthinking1]

the budget was wrong

According to George, it's the Lib Dems fault. What a charming fella:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2119948/Osbornes-letter-rant-Clegg-granny-tax-backlash.html

[MrGongGong]

Just had to give Du Hast a quick blast with the volume set at 12.00 o'clock!

Might give Schubert's Trout Mask Quintet a spin later (we've gone off topic again - Belgian Frank will dispatch us to some corner of the chat-room!)

Now a Van Vliet take on The Trout or even a Schubert take on Bat Chain Puller would gladden my heart indeed !

[Lateralthinking1]

Telegraph : George Osborne's reputation has taken a serious knock:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/georgeosborne/9164088/Budget-2012-George-Osbornes-reputation-has-taken-a-serious-knock.html

While the "granny tax" policy is in many respects mild, this week marks a turning point. They have bashed huge numbers of people and got away with it - students, the disabled, public sector workers, some on child benefits and many more. It appears that it is the elderly who have sent a signal about boundaries. This is good news for all. They have already slipped four percentage points. Now all Labour need to do is explain why ten members of the opposition front bench have close links with Price Waterhouse.

[amateur51]

Didn't the state pension lag behind for many years (decades)?

If you don't have a political body like a trades union to lobby on behalf of your interests, and if you don't have any means of increasing your income, any sort of freeze or reduction will be felt harder than maybe an outsider would think. Most of us don't have to live on the level of the basic state pension until we get there. i live on disability benefits, for which I am most grateful, and it is largely a hand-to-mouth existence compared to that of people who are only marginally better off.

This is what I was trying to say ....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVxF4z-R2YM

Just as true today