The Story Of Light Music

[salymap]

Muir Mathieson, who conducted the music for many films and lectured in London music colleges was keen on saying
that in his opinion there were only two kinds of music, good music and bad music.

[Lateralthinking1]

Question....Is the Kodaly Hary Janos music light or heavy? I love it [or Peter and the Wolf], but surely they are light, in the best possible way.

I love Kodaly's Harry Janos and like Peter and the Wolf. If you want a definition of light, Wally Stott's bizarre bubblegum piece about inter-clan warfare in Scotland to the tune of a Corrido ballad (Traditional Mexican form that utilises a waltz like rhythm to convey a story of rural frontier folk heroism) probably comes close. I never thought I'd see the day when a follow-up to "Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep" would be discussed on this forum but this one makes two in as many weeks. Tweedle Dee Tweedle Dum.

This isn't to say that the series won't be a real education. There is obviously much more to Wally and indeed Angela than someone born in the 1960s could know; I sort of know Semprini and Mantovani and would like to know the stories behind the names - they fall into categories of history I find interesting ; Eric Coates has certainly written things I like but I've forgotten them; and Elgar here looks like a square peg in a round hole. The big plus is that it looks far from predictable, not that most of the music will excite.

[vinteuil]

Has the BBC Light Programme ceased programming 'light music'?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Light_Programme

[cloughie]

Has the BBC Light Programme ceased programming 'light music'?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Light_Programme

Largely yes, the graduation of DJs from Radio 1 to 2 does not help!

[PJPJ]

Would those anti "Light Music" also be against Jazz and World Music on R3, too?

Frankly, I wouldn't mind at all if Light appeared on R2 as long as online listening was at 320/aac and not compressed.

[vinteuil]

Would those anti "Light Music" also be against Jazz and World Music on R3, too?

.

... I'm happy for jazz and world music to have a home on radio 3.

My beef with the invasion of 'light music' on to the radio 3 airwaves is that there is (?) / was a radio service which was supposed to supply 'light' music - the Light Programme, nowadays radio 2.

[Hornspieler]

Muir Mathieson, who conducted the music for many films and lectured in London music colleges was keen on saying
that in his opinion there were only two kinds of music, good music and bad music.

Something I have been telling people for years. The likes of Trevor Duncan, Leo Norman, Frederick Curzon and Arthur Benjamin wrote some very good music.

Beethoven, whom we all consider one of the very best composers also wrote some very bad music - The battle symphony being a very good example. So did a lot of other exalted "classical" composers.

In the 1950s the BBC had what was called "The Unit" The unit comprised such orchestras as Frank Chacksfield, The London Light Concert Orchestra (Michael Krein), The Casino Orchestra (Reginald Kilbey) Monia Liter's 2oth Century Serenaders, The Majestic Orchestra (Lou Whiteson) and of course The BBC Revue Orchestra and BBC Variety Orchestra. Outside of London, there was the BBC Midland Light Orchestra (Gilbert Vinter) The BBC Scottish Variety Orchestra (Kemlo Stephen) The BBC Northern Ireland Light Orchestra and the BBC West Country players.
Where are those orchestras now - and where is the music with which they used to entertain radio listeners?

I played regularly for the "Unit" in those days and some of that music took a lot of getting round. People will happily listen to "The Girl with the Flaxen Hair" by Debussy, but turn their noses up at "The Girl from Corsica" by Trevor Duncan, which is (IMV) a far superior composition.
Reznicek's overture "Donna Diana" can find a place on any concert programme but I think that Leo Norman's "Overture to a Picaresque Comedy" is of equal merit.

There is a lot of snobbery about light music - not least among those who claim to be music lovers.

HS

[cloughie]

... I'm happy for jazz and world music to have a home on radio 3.

My beef with the invasion of 'light music' on to the radio 3 airwaves is that there is (?) / was a radio service which was supposed to supply 'light' music - the Light Programme, nowadays radio 2.

When did you last listen to Radio 2 Vin?

[vinteuil]

When did you last listen to Radio 2 Vin?

... probably 1957. Which explains a lot, perhaps...

.

[Pabmusic]

There is a lot of snobbery about light music - not least among those who claim to be music lovers.
HS

How I agree! Elgar did not write 'light' and 'serious' works - he wrote music, some of which was serious, others no so. How am I so sure? Because no-one had yet categorised any music as being exclusively 'light'. That didn't really happen until radio and the gramophone were well established (4-minute slots being important). The BBC Light Programme dated from 1945, and did much (most?) to popularise the term; you won’t find its common use before then.

It's also largely a British phenomenon. All countries produced music we might call 'light' - for military bands, tea-room ensembles, dance orchestras, as well as operettas - but it was mainly us who treated it so snobbishly. Here are a few pieces which, if the categorisation had been available then, might have been 'light' music:

Mozart: Eine Kleine Nachtmusik (and any other serenade), Les Petits Riens
Beethoven: Violin Romances, Battle symphony, Für Elise
Schubert: German Dances, marches.
Weber: Invitation to the Dance
Schumann: Carnaval, Papillons, Kinderzenen
Dvorak: Slavonic Dances, My Home, Bagatelles, Czech Suite.
Brahms: Hungarian Dances, Academic Festival Overture
Mendelssohn: Songs Without Words
Grieg: Norwegian Dances, Symphonic Dances, Holberg Suite, Lyric Pieces
Liszt: Hungarian Rhapsodies

We don’t call these light music, of course. Neither do we class The Merry Wives Of Windsor or The Bartered Bride as operettas, yet they’re not far from it, and again not far from Edward German. Yet we’re quite happy to dismiss German and Coates – not to mention Binge, Duncan, Farnon, Goodwin and dozens more – as music that is not good enough (not serious enough? not sincere enough?) for Radio 3. Odd, given that the category ‘light’ is an entirely artificial barrier we have erected ourselves.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

There is a lot of snobbery about light music - not least among those who claim to be music lovers.

HS

There's been a lot of snobbery in the music world for longer than I can remember. As a music student, I wasn't really supposed to write anything that sounded like a "tune".
The works of Ketleby et al are so wonderfully crafted.

And Hornspieler, it is so good to have you back.

[Hornspieler]

How I agree! Elgar did not write 'light' and 'serious' works - he wrote music, some of which was serious, others no so. How am I so sure? Because no-one had yet categorised any music as being exclusively 'light'. That didn't really happen until radio and the gramophone were well established (4-minute slots being important). The BBC Light Programme dated from 1945, and did much (most?) to popularise the term; you won’t find its common use before then.

It's also largely a British phenomenon. All countries produced music we might call 'light' - for military bands, tea-room ensembles, dance orchestras, as well as operettas - but it was mainly us who treated it so snobbishly. Here are a few pieces which, if the categorisation had been available then, might have been 'light' music:

Mozart: Eine Kleine Nachtmusik (and any other serenade), Les Petits Riens
Beethoven: Violin Romances, Battle symphony, Für Elise
Schubert: German Dances, marches.
Weber: Invitation to the Dance
Schumann: Carnaval, Papillons, Kinderzenen
Dvorak: Slavonic Dances, My Home, Bagatelles, Czech Suite.
Brahms: Hungarian Dances, Academic Festival Overture
Mendelssohn: Songs Without Words
Grieg: Norwegian Dances, Symphonic Dances, Holberg Suite, Lyric Pieces
Liszt: Hungarian Rhapsodies

We don’t call these light music, of course. Neither do we class The Merry Wives Of Windsor or The Bartered Bride as operettas, yet they’re not far from it, and again not far from Edward German. Yet we’re quite happy to dismiss German and Coates – not to mention Binge, Duncan, Farnon, Goodwin and dozens more – as music that is not good enough (not serious enough? not sincere enough?) for Radio 3. Odd, given that the category ‘light’ is an entirely artificial barrier we have erected ourselves.

Spot on!

[John Wright]

Excellent contributions form Hornspeiler and Pabmusic, thank you.

You might be interested in parts of last night's Radio 2 'Friday Night Is Music Night', a 60th anniversary of the BBC Concert Orchestra. Includes archive programme excerpts, 1987 and 1993, of the orchestra, tributes to Robert Farnon (who died in 2005) and Stanley Black (who died in 2002).

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01bwky9

[greenilex]

I used to love Workers Playtime and Music While You Work. Can we hear them again?

[gurnemanz]

Here are a few pieces which, if the categorisation had been available then, might have been 'light' music:

Mozart: Eine Kleine Nachtmusik (and any other serenade), Les Petits Riens
Beethoven: Violin Romances, Battle symphony, Für Elise
Schubert: German Dances, marches.
Weber: Invitation to the Dance
Schumann: Carnaval, Papillons, Kinderzenen
Dvorak: Slavonic Dances, My Home, Bagatelles, Czech Suite.
Brahms: Hungarian Dances, Academic Festival Overture
Mendelssohn: Songs Without Words
Grieg: Norwegian Dances, Symphonic Dances, Holberg Suite, Lyric Pieces
Liszt: Hungarian Rhapsodies

We don’t call these light music, of course. Neither do we class The Merry Wives Of Windsor or The Bartered Bride as operettas, yet they’re not far from it, and again not far from Edward German. Yet we’re quite happy to dismiss German and Coates – not to mention Binge, Duncan, Farnon, Goodwin and dozens more – as music that is not good enough (not serious enough? not sincere enough?) for Radio 3. Odd, given that the category ‘light’ is an entirely artificial barrier we have erected ourselves.

You could certainly add quite a few Schubert songs to the list. If you play them why not also Cole Porter and Gershwin? "Light music" seems to be acceptable if written by composers who also have credentials as serious composers.

One the one hand, I can't see why a 24-7 schedule should not be able to accommodate light music. No one listens to everything. Some "heavy music" is just as likely to make me switch off of some light music. On the other hand, while there are umpteen popular music stations, for me the main argument for keeping Radio 3 seriously classical (hard to define though that admittedly may be) is that it is the only British station that comes even close to taking on this role. (I can't stomach ClassicFM). I would like to be able to have the option of tuning in to this type of music at any time, eg between 10 and 12 in the evening before I go to bed. This being a time when little classical music is actually broadcast on Radio 3, it is my main CD listening time.