Music you've known about but never heard until recently

[amateur51]

Oh come on, every schoolboy knows about the sign-writer who needed to leave more space between each of the words when writing the sign for the Pig and Whistle. i.e. between the Pig and and and and and and and Whistle.

With respect, that is a phrase, not a sentence as requested by Dave2002

[aeolium]

I"m sure there must be other reflective versions of the Brahms Piano Quintet (compared with Pollini et al), but until Elias/Fleischer I was unaware that it could be played in this way.
There are imperfections (both pianist and the quartet intonation/timing isn't always quite perfect), but I've revisited this a few times now.

I'd be interested to know if there are other performances in this kind of style.

Dave2002, I think of the versions I have heard Takacs/Schiff and the Nash Ensemble are more reflective/chamber style performances compared with Pollini and the Italians, which although an extraordinary performance seems to make the work sound almost orchestral in its power. Fleischer has recorded the work with the Emerson Quartet, but I have not heard this version.

I'm afraid I thought the Elias/Fleischer performance had just too many errors, especially in the last movement, and problems of ensemble. But, as you say, it's interesting to hear a very different interpretation.

[Auferstehen2]

11 !!!!??

Do you mean "had" - or is that now a euphonism for "hand" or "and"?

Eleven consecutive words in a meaningful sentence seems hard to me.

Dave2002, I surfed for 11 “hads”, and this came up:

“James while John had had had had had had had had had had had a better effect on the teacher.”

Pretty meaningless, until the correct punctuation is inserted. Then,

“James, while John had had “had”, had had “had had”; “had had” had had a better effect on the teacher.”

Maybe correct, but still silly IMV.

Mario

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Re. the earlier fhg/roehre discussion of Stravinsky's serial pieces - Hans Keller once remarked that IS only composed this way once Schoenberg was dead...

Hans Keller was a very naughty boy!

Schoenberg's death coincided with Stravinsky reaching a crisis in his work: a genuine sense that he had exhausted what he could do with Music after The Rake's Progress. Fortunately, this crisis coincided with his encountering the work of Robert Craft - with Babbitt, one of the few people wiho held Stravinsky and Schoenberg in equal esteem. Craft (and Babbitt to a lesser degree) was able to demonstrate how Serial Music "worked" and dispelled the prejudice that Stravinsky's earlier friends had encouraged that Serialism was just an arbitrary re-ordering of the chromatic scale. Working with Hexachords re-invigorated IS' creative juices: he discovered new ways of Serial working, leading to those astonishing, wonderful final works ... which are as removed from Schoenberg's practices and aesthetics as Oedipus Rex.

Whether Stravinsky would have embraced serial principles whilst Schoenberg was still alive cannot be answered. I suspect (read "fantasize") that the new possibilities that Serialism offered the "ailing" Stravinsky would have outweighed his personal pride. I also like to believe that Craft might have effected some kind of ... personal "relationship" (it wouldn't have been exactly "friendly"!) between the two greatest composers: both used Craft to "sound out" what the other was doing in the three last years of AS' life.


Relevance to the Thread? I heartily recommend Stravinsky's Music from the '50s and '60s to anyone who "knows about it but has never heard until now"!

Best Wishes.

[Roehre]

Hans Keller was a very naughty boy!

And not an original one on top of that.

Whether Stravinsky would have embraced serial principles whilst Schönberg was still alive cannot be answered. I suspect (read "fantasize") that the new possibilities that Serialism offered the "ailing" Stravinsky would have outweighed his personal pride. I also like to believe that Craft might have effected some kind of ... personal "relationship" (it wouldn't have been exactly "friendly"!) between the two greatest composers: both used Craft to "sound out" what the other was doing in the three last years of AS' life.

The first time Craft arrived at Schönberg's home, Schönberg is heard to have exclaimed "Zomeone from ze ozzer camp!"

IMO Stravinsky's attitude towards dodecaphony shows a strong resemblance to Beethoven's appreciation of piano concertos, symphonies and string quartets during the time Mozart and Haydn respectively were still alive and composing:
inevitably attracted and interested, and planning eventually trying out these forms himself, but not yet.

Re Stravinsky: is there really so much difference between The Rake's Progress and the Shakespeare songs, or between the first and the last tableau of Agon?

[Nick Armstrong]

Oh come on, every schoolboy knows about the sign-writer who needed to leave more space between each of the words when writing the sign for the Pig and Whistle. i.e. between the Pig and and and and and and and Whistle.

What are you talking about, Bryn?

[Panjandrum]

Some people are slow on the uptake.

[Bryn]

What are you talking about, Bryn?

O.k., I got a bit too andy (by two) when entering that on my tablet (on my Greenline bus journey to work this morning). It should have read "Pig and and and and and Whistle".

[Auferstehen2]

O.k., I got a bit too andy (by two) when entering that on my tablet.

Ah, but that's another joke isn't it, Bryn?

"And, and, and, and, Andy, what are you talking about?" stuttered Peter.

Mario

[cloughie]

O.k., I got a bit too andy (by two) when entering that on my tablet (on my Greenline bus journey to work this morning). It should have read "Pig and and and and and Whistle".

Give us a clue - what has all this to do with 'Music you've known about but never heard until recently'.

[amateur51]

Give us a clue - what has all this to do with 'Music you've known about but never heard until recently'.

Good man, cloughie

[jayne lee wilson]

Indeed - Lord Peter Whimsy is posting just a little too often on these boards...

Give us a clue - what has all this to do with 'Music you've known about but never heard until recently'.

[Bryn]

Give us a clue - what has all this to do with 'Music you've known about but never heard until recently'.

#103

[cloughie]

#103

And what's that got to do with it?

[Bryn]

And what's that got to do with it?

Seek and discover. Some of us are polite enough to respond to questions posed here, whether strictly 'on topic' or otherwise.