Pronunciation watch

[Roslynmuse]

The Doings of Deborah, or What Debbie Did Next?

Gives me the heebee-geebees just to think about it... (or maybe just the Bee Gees?)

[french frank]

Gives me the heebee-geebees

[Richard Tarleton]

I know it's below the belt to criticise professional (or, more likely, proffessional) classical music presenters for their foreign pronunciation. But they only have to ask the Pronunciation Unit to get at least an approximation that will be generally understood.

But, as we know, they don't. They're perfectly happy with their own pronunciation and do not refer themselves. And the PU does not offer advice unless asked. So nothing changes. And the BBC bureaucracy does not admit of advice from the PU being passed to presenters unless they've asked for it. I refer to a certain long-running saga.

It used to be a requirement of the job. Forgive me for again mentioning Stephanie Hughes' [one of RW's first casualties] description of her audition to become a R3 presenter - among other things she was handed a list of difficult composers' names, which she read off without any problem. Now, it is the least of their worries.

[french frank]

My impression was that such matters were shrugged off by the late régime. But given that on the website accents are simply missed off, how is any supposed to be able to use the linguistic knowledge they do have to be pretty sure of being able to 'guess' the pronunciation?

For the record (hmm), Lay Fate Deb was in fact Rameau's Les fêtes d'Hébé (cf playlist Les Fetes d'Hebe Overture).

[mercia]

a propos Carnival of the Animals, Mr Swain reminded me this afternoon how zoological should be pronounced i.e. zo-ological - whereas I say zoo-ological - I guess I'm a bit common

[if zoo is short for zoological should we perhaps give it two syllables ? zo-o]

[mangerton]

Certainly. And spell it zoö.

[vinteuil]

Certainly. And spell it zoö.

... or why not ζῷον ?

[Ockeghem's Razor]

Today's Early Music Show (otherwise a fine little look at aspects of Rameau) had Rammo throughout and the appearance of a minor late Latin poet called, seemingly, Ausonias, produced smugly by the speaker as a cuniculus ex pilleo rather than a deus ex machina in order to make a point.

[Serial_Apologist]

a cuniculus ex pilleo

I once had a girlfriend who kept one of those under her's, I think...

[Ockeghem's Razor]

I once had a girlfriend who kept one of those under her's, I think...

[french frank]

had Rammo throughout

Rammo has been played quite a bit lately. I find the pronunciation interesting because there is a beatum medium between the excruciating exaggerated guttural 'R' and the hammer on the final syllable (sort of GhrraMAW) and the in-your-face Englishness of RAMmoh-oo. The balance of 'correctness', comprehensibility and unobtrusiveness presents a degree of difficulty as to make it impossible, apparently.

[Ockeghem's Razor]

Point taken. I'm afraid every time I hear 'Rammo' I am put in mind of my 32 year old son's demotic usage: "We could try to get a pint in the Pineapple but it will probably be rammo at this time of day."

[Ockeghem's Razor]

Rammo has been played quite a bit lately. I find the pronunciation interesting because there is a beatum medium between the excruciating exaggerated guttural 'R' and the hammer on the final syllable (sort of GhrraMAW) and the in-your-face Englishness of RAMmoh-oo. The balance of 'correctness', comprehensibility and unobtrusiveness presents a degree of difficulty as to make it impossible, apparently.

This reminds me of hearing the late Richard Cobb pronounce 'Robespierre'. It seemed to have a lot more 'r' sounds than on paper.

[Don Petter]

Point taken. I'm afraid every time I hear 'Rammo' I am put in mind of my 32 year old son's demotic usage: "We could try to get a pint in the Pineapple but it will probably be rammo at this time of day."

This is a recent post in the rmcr newsgroup:

I've mentioned before that a not-unknown conductor I asked about Radio 3's bad habits told me they mispronounce things and mumble as a matter of policy, because some moron at the top thinks getting it too right is going to put humble folks off.

[Ockeghem's Razor]

I agree that this is dreadfully patronising. The only way in which those who do not know how to pronounce say, Goethe, will learn is to hear it spoken correctly. Perhaps pronouncing 'menu' as if it were French is going too far: my head of department, whose father once danced the fox-trot with Lady Diana Cooper, did this but his was a definite hyperlect. Great fun to hear, all the same.