Pronunciation watch

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

And why not Death and Transfiguration if there's difficulty with German pronunciation?!


(Or "Death and Transfirugation".)

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Well this is how yesterday's afternoon's presenter pronounced Richard Strauss's Tod und Verklarung. Several times he told us that the next piece was 'Tot (as in Dot) unt Verklarnug' and frankly, I could not believe my ears. Surely, if an announcer, who has not knowledge of the German language would seek assistance from the appropriate BBC dept?

Even when the piece had finished, the same mispronunciation was repeated. Oh, deary me. How standards have dropped at the Beeb.

Perhaps this is one for "Pronunciation Watch'.

Some of the feeble attempts at Welsh pronunciation are as bad.

[Stanfordian]

Perhaps this is one for "Pronunciation Watch'.

Some of the feeble attempts at Welsh pronunciation are as bad.

Why, is there not a Pronunciation Department at BBC Derham Towers?

[french frank]

(Or "Death and Transfirugation".)

I've just listened. Sounded more like Tod to rhyme with clod to me. Fairklairnug, fairy-nuff. Twice at the beginning and once at the end.

Why is there not a Pronunciation Department at BBC Derham Towers?

There is, though it was Tom McKinney on this occasion.

[Serial_Apologist]

I've just listened. Sounded more like Tod to rhyme with clod to me. Fairklairnug, fairy-nuff. Twice at the beginning and once at the end.



There is, though it was Tom McKinney on this occasion.

I feel sure he wasn't as nissed as a pute on this occasion.

[Richard Tarleton]

I am probably the forum's resident expert on the BBC's Pronunciation Unit .

Its address is:
BBC Pronunciation Research Unit
Area C, 6th Floor
New Broadcasting House, W1

(just along from the office of the Head of Values, I think )

[gurnemanz]

On the other hand, Hannah French deserves a word of praise for her pronunciation of the song titles in this week's most enjoyable lunchtime Lieder sessions - natural-sounding German with which and only a nit-picker would find fault. More tomorrow.

[kernelbogey]

...it was Tom McKinney on this occasion.

I could almost forigive the mispronunciation - were it not for the '-nug' - which means he hadn't even bothered to read the word.

[LMcD]

On the other hand, Hannah French deserves a word of praise for her pronunciation of the song titles in this week's most enjoyable lunchtime Lieder sessions - natural-sounding German with which and only a nit-picker would find fault.

[oddoneout]

Do they not have time to go through their scripts beforehand to identify possible problems? Or if problems are noted there are not the means to deal with them - lack of time and/or access to suitable pronunciation advice?
Somewhat off topic I am amused by how triumphant a couple of presenters have sounded recently when they have negotiated the current CBSO conductor's name.

[Dave2002]

Well this is how yesterday's afternoon's presenter pronounced Richard Strauss's Tod und Verklarung. Several times he told us that the next piece was 'Tot (as in Dot) unt Verklarnug' ...

Actually he pronounced the "Tod" differently on some occasions, certainly once with a 't' ending, and once with a harder 'd' ending and the vowel was a short 'o' - as in 'hot', but the "Verklarnug" does seem to have been fixed in his brain and mouth coordination. As for the "und" - well it was pretty much thrown away. I don't think it was a hanging offence though!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I don't think it was a hanging offence though!

No - but it's his job; what else does he have to do that gets in the way of checking how a regular concert item should be pronounced? (It's "Dobly" all over again!)

[Dave2002]

No - but it's his job; what else does he have to do that gets in the way of checking how a regular concert item should be pronounced? (It's "Dobly" all over again!)

Some people round here take these things too seriously. I've given up on trying to suggest how many Swedish names are actually pronounced by native speakers (I'm not one), and I suspect that Dutch is just hopeless for anyone who wasn't brought up in the Netherlands. I have several friends who are Dutch speakers - one from the Netherlands, and one British, but with Dutch parents and his wife. The "correct" pronunciation of some words sounds like one needs to have a sick bowl at the ready.

[french frank]

I don't think it was a hanging offence though!

If you mean literally, no. But if this is a story I've told before, do stop me

Some years back when my brother had five children in their late teens/twenties, I was invited to Sunday lunch. In the morning, I read a news story about a pop singer - don't remember exactly what but I think it involved his boat: rescued, rescued someone else. Over lunch I thought that would be a news topic to mention to nephews and nieces into pop music. "I see Boh-noh was in the news this morning." Dead silence, and then an unimpressed voice said: "It's Bonno."

This got me thinking that a DJ/presenter on a popular radio station wouldn't get wrong something the audience would know. And if they did, like me they'd be revealed as someone who didn't know what they were talking about. Too often Radio 3's "Trusted guides" reveal that they're giving out (mis)information about music that they probably knew nothing about or even hadn't heard of before they were asked to announce it in a knowledgeable, authoritative tone. Given that no one knows everything about the entire range of core classical music, the problem is exacerbated when someone has to announce 20+ pieces on a Monday, another 20+ on a Tuesday, another 20+ on … and so on. Is it possible for them to be able to prepare accurate, informative details on 100+ pieces in a week? Especially if they're writing books, newspaper articles, presenting other radio programmes at the same time?

At the very least could those with a (very) limited knowledge be extensively trained before allowing them to pontificate over the air waves, and then monitored? I ask myself …

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

This got me thinking that a DJ/presenter on a popular radio station wouldn't get wrong something the audience would know. And if they did, like me they'd be revealed as someone who didn't know what they were talking about.

Precisely. Some folks round here just don't take these things seriously enough - or maybe it just doesn't matter to them.