Further examples of a country that has simply turned bad

[Lateralthinking1]

Thanks to all for the tips. I have an emergency visit to the dentist in an hour. Truly awful night.

I wrote earlier about the way in which boundaries have become fuzzier. As legislation in personal areas has permitted freedoms, with consequential behavioural change, legislation has tightened in areas that are metaphorical of that loosening.

It is the same I think with tackling discrimination. As soon as a number of groups are adequately protected, the instinct for discrimination shifts. It is then gingers or whatever. Makes you think that it is discrimination as behaviour that needs addressing perhaps more than who or what is being discriminated against.

I also think that as social welfare has drifted - the onset of the tougher nation state - everyday folk are required to be nastier in their work roles. Often this makes them uncomfortable. Hence the need to create huge numbers of nasties that are not them - ie the portrayal in society of everyone as a potential rapist, murderer, mugger etc as a defence mechanism. This then leads to cameras and so on. Again, the legislation deals with metaphor, not the realities which are generally milder.

I haven't exactly lived abroad but I have spent 26 weeks of my life sort of living in Geneva. 13 trips to the UN, each lasting a fortnight.

[MrGongGong]

Ah, yes. Of course. That happens all the time, doesn't it? Whereas muggings happen about once every twenty years. How silly of me.

goodness me you actually think that it happens at all !!!
small steps comrades
by the same logic the ICBM approach to protecting the Olympics is also unnecessary as the Olympics only happen every 4 years and only twice in 100 years in the UK (sorry LONDON ............)

What would Elgar do ?


This is a fine idea !!!

"As for the olympics..........if there was a real genuine (non mossad/CIA sponsored ) threat to a few bike and running races that in any normal year nobody could care less about, I think they should be cancelled, and the stadium and village handed over to the residents of Leyton."

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

i must say that the fact of the Olympics rather makes Lart's main point for me ... i am very happy they are in LONDON and not here ... the property develpers needed the handouts eh ...

[Mr Pee]

the thing that worries me about the post 9/11 world is the way governments reacted, not the threat of terrorists.

oh, and the taxi thing is happening in Southampton as well, if the powers that be get their way.

As for the olympics..........if there was a real genuine (non mossad/CIA sponsored ) threat to a few bike and running races that in any normal year nobody could care less about, I think they should be cancelled, and the stadium and village handed over to the residents of Leyton.

Hang on, run that past me again.....Mossad/CIA are going to attack the London Olympics. Pray, do tell how you came by this revelation? There was I thinking the threat came from what's left of Al-Quaeda, or at least some loony home-grown Islamists operating under the name.

[MrGongGong]

Don't be daft mrP
the Americans have solved the problem of terrorism by killing Bin Laden
in the same way that Christianity was wiped out by killing Jesus

[Mahlerei]

Won't firing missiles during the Olympics lead to false starts?

[Mr Pee]

Don't be daft mrP
the Americans have solved the problem of terrorism by killing Bin Laden
in the same way that Christianity was wiped out by killing Jesus

Oh....please......you're accusing ME of being daft?????

Of course the problem of terrorism hasn't been solved by killing Bin-Laden. There are always going to be nutters who will follow his murderous, hate-filled doctrine, but by removing the figurehead of the organisation, there is no doubt that it has been considerably weakened. Or perhaps we should just roll over, say we'll never defeat terrorism, and give up, allowing Bin-Laden and his psychopathic cronies to live out their days in peace and comfort?

[Mahlerei]

History shows we always have to negotiating with the terrorists in the end.

[Mr Pee]

Won't firing missiles during the Olympics lead to false starts?

And you're right about negotiation- but in the case of Al-Q, there's a long road to travel before that is even a remote possibility. For now, weakening and fragmenting the organisation must be the priority.

[MrGongGong]

That's clever mrP
from what we read in the press its not an "organisation" like Tesco or the Elgar Society !
so then when "we" come to negotiation "we" wont know who to negotiate with as "we" will have fragmented it so much !

[Dave2002]

I have, Dave, in a country that has historical and contemporary (not unrelated, of course), political, social and economic problems of some tragic weight. But I don't quite see what you are saying. That because it's worse in other countries be grateful for whatever you get here?

I have lived abroad in two different countries for over five years. It takes time to get to know another country - and what you might discover is likely to be very different from simply visiting for holidays.
In my admittedly limited, but rather more than many people have, experience, there are good and bad things in other countries too. My point can be summarised roughly by paraphrasing Churchill - "yes, the UK is pretty **** at a lot of things, and a **** place to live, but overall it's still one of the best places to be." That is, of course, just my opinion. It also depends what you value in a country/place to live. If you simply want money, or weather then other countries may do better, but if you want to live in a place where many things work moderately well, and most people behave reasonably well then the UK is surely near the top of the list.

Re your point that we should be grateful for what we have here - well, yes - up to a point. I'm not suggesting that we shouldn't point out the problems, and indeed complain about them, but what I am saying is that the overall deal is not too bad. At least you can complain, or is it moaning?

Related to that though, I'll quote an old joke. "How do you know when a British aircraft lands in Los Angeles? The whining continues after the engines have been turned off." Moaning (whining) is something the Brits are good at. Complaining implies taking one's grievances to someone who can fix the problems, rather than, as some of my friends have done in the past, using them as a means to while away time after dinner with stories about what happened or did not happen in various places. Example, rather than moan that the TV didn't work or the curtains fell down in a hotel, how many people would actually think of phoning up the hotel manager and telling him/her about the problem? In some countries (e.g USA) that approach actually works - though not all!

[Serial_Apologist]

Example, rather than moan that the TV didn't work or the curtains fell down in a hotel, how many people would actually think of phoning up the hotel manager and telling him/her about the problem. In some countries (e.g USA) that approach actually works - though not all!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyHTTMkq5RE&feature=related

[ahinton]

Quite possibly because you might get mugged on the way, although with any luck CCTV cameras in the area will help the police track down your assailants.

Provided, of course, that the police themselves are not those assailants - you know, by accident and in the course of their very onerous duties, don't you know, sorry and all that...

[teamsaint]

Hang on, run that past me again.....Mossad/CIA are going to attack the London Olympics. Pray, do tell how you came by this revelation? There was I thinking the threat came from what's left of Al-Quaeda, or at least some loony home-grown Islamists operating under the name.

That@s what you thought. But the CIA and Mossad have form as long as your arm.

You know, vietnam, assasination of JKF, Nicaragua, murder of Iranian scientists, etc etc. And god knows what in afghanistan.

Why wouldn't they? The people at the top run these organisations. They brought us things like the First world war. (remind me again what that was about?)

I am a LOT more worried about what our governments do against their own people than the odd loony terrorist, nasty though they are.
Remember the lies about Iraqi weapons of mass destruction.

Oh , and what I was suggesting was, if there IS a "terrorist attack" at the running races, it will as likely be mossad/CIA/MI6 as a genuine middle eastern loony, not that it was likely to happen.

[Mr Pee]

That@s what you thought. But the CIA and Mossad have form as long as your arm.

You know, vietnam, assasination of JKF, Nicaragua, murder of Iranian scientists, etc etc. And god knows what in afghanistan.

Why wouldn't they? The people at the top run these organisations. They brought us things like the First world war. (remind me again what that was about?)

I am a LOT more worried about what our governments do against their own people than the odd loony terrorist, nasty though they are.
Remember the lies about Iraqi weapons of mass destruction.

Oh , and what I was suggesting was, if there IS a "terrorist attack" at the running races, it will as likely be mossad/CIA/MI6 as a genuine middle eastern loony, not that it was likely to happen.

So not only were the CIA behind the murder of JFK, but they and Mossad started the First World War as well?? I didn't think either of these two organisations even existed in 1914....

And erm...here's what it was "about".... http://www.firstworldwar.com/origins/causes.htm

You really think it more likely that an attack will come from a Western Intelligence agency? Seriously? No doubt you also think that 9/11 was carried out by the US Government........

Keep taking the tablets.