Rugby World Cup 2011

[DracoM]

And frankly, pretty damned lucky to have scraped home, possibly as a direct result in the last five minutes of one blatant and cynical obstruction on Paterson after an astute chip kick forward at which point Scotland had a 3 on 1 situation out wide. England seem to have learnt many of the truly dangerous and unpleasant 'tackling skills' of the Pacific islands from members in their squad.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

...that incident seems to have slipped by me DracoM; it is a win, and a win is a win, and a foul is what the referee blows for eh .... Scotland are not scoring tries so it was the usual Scots problem an attack that lacks teeth but not fight against an English defence that does not shirk defensive work .. no tries against so far ... and "when it does the simple things right" scores tries [i refer solely to recent rugby history }

[Anna]

As England were assured of going through (barring an exceptional final score from Scotland) did they play the first half as it they couldn't be bothered or were they all over the place as they seem to be lacking in team spirit? So, they meet France next weekend, which judging by France's display today (what is the problem still affecting France?) should be a walk in the park. As to the permutations beyond that I'm not sure but I do know that England have never looked like possible WC winners or ever looked as they are putting their heart and soul into the game, although a win is a win by fair means or foul.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

england did not look too good in this match or against Argentina ... flustered is what it was, too keyed up and too startled .... they lack maturity i think, not team spirit ... and leadership on the field, not good decision making or control in first half ....

[vinteuil]

... what is the problem still affecting France?

the view in the French press, and blog comments, seems to be that French rugby has fallen under the same malaise as French footleball - ie too much commercialism, concentration on sponsorship, individual preening, lack of team spirit - rather than working on the game isself...

[LHC]

england did not look too good in this match or against Argentina ... flustered is what it was, too keyed up and too startled .... they lack maturity i think, not team spirit ... and leadership on the field, not good decision making or control in first half ....

I disagree. This game followed the usual pattern of England Scotland games (as did the game with Argentina). They are always tense affairs with little to separate the teams and not much to interest the neutral.

In the first half especially, England played like a team afraid to lose, rather than a team determined to win, while Scotland lacked the quality to score tries, or pull away from England.

I don't think it will have much impact on the rest of the tournament, and neither will France's terrible performance this morning. I wouldn't be surprised if either England or France made it as far as the Final.

[Anna]

Don't suppose anyone watched the Wales v Fiji game? Nine tries and every single conversion went over, straight as a die, no problems with the ball today! Even at 80 minutes they were still pushing and scored the final try, great team spirit and determination. Presumably Ireland awaits, unless Italy upset things? It may seem beating Fiji is no big deal but there is history (2007)

Not a good day for England, on top of Dwarfgate and Ballgate Johnson has had to reprimand Haskell, Hartley & Ashton for lewd comments to female hotel worker and Armitage has been cited and will be judged tomorrow.

[amateur51]

Don't suppose anyone watched the Wales v Fiji game? Nine tries and every single conversion went over, straight as a die, no problems with the ball today! Even at 80 minutes they were still pushing and scored the final try, great team spirit and determination. Presumably Ireland awaits, unless Italy upset things? It may seem beating Fiji is no big deal but there is history (2007)

Not a good day for England, on top of Dwarfgate and Ballgate Johnson has had to reprimand Haskell, Hartley & Ashton for lewd comments to female hotel worker and Armitage has been cited and will be judged tomorrow.

A triffic display, Anna At last Warren seems to have found a team that he can inspire to consistent glory but Ireland will be a major test I'm afraid.

[DracoM]

<< Delon Armitage will appear at disciplinary hearing in Auckland on Monday after being cited for a "dangerous high tackle" on Scotland's Chris Paterson. The offence carries a guideline suspension of between two and 10 weeks. >>

As reported in The Guardian. See my comment upthread.

[Anna]

And Courtney Lawes got a 2 match ban for his actions when they played Argentina. Reading the reports in today's papers (by Eddie Butler and other commentators) they say England "slouched" or "stumbled" into the quarters and will no doubt reach the final against (probably) New Zealand. Which is fair enough, nothing against England but have they played a match which has been pretty, or fast-flowing, skillful or elegant? I don't think it's been the booze or loutish behaviour in the hotel that's the concern, it's the lack of cohesion, team spirit, leadership on the pitch and, although it has been rather glossed over, the blatant attempt to cheat by ball switching to keep Jonny, the National Treasure, happy (although he is entirely innocent) They say a win is a win but at that level we expect some decent rugby. And, while I'm here, Tindall should go as he adds nothing to the proceedings and Flood should replace him.

Wales have an advantage in youth and fitness Sam Warburton, Captain is 22, and the wonderful George North is only 19, Felatou and Scott Williams 20. But against O'Gara, O'Driscoll, etc., then I suspect Ireland will get the better of them but it should be a cracking match. What France are going to be like, Heaven knows. They may all go on strike!

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

...i am with Martin Johnson, England should concentrate on improving their play, i doubt he is underestimating the challenge of defeating France ... btw agree about Tyndall, and do not see why Easter is not a first pick ...

[Rolmill]

...nothing against England

have they played a match which has been pretty, or fast-flowing, skillful or elegant?

Yes, against Romania (well, Romania's 'B' team!)

lack of cohesion, team spirit, leadership on the pitch

Not sure why you doubt England's team spirit? Leadership (both on and off the pitch), yes; cohesion, possibly; team spirit, don't see the evidence.

although it has been rather glossed over, the blatant attempt to cheat by ball switching

Not glossed over, just a mistake dealt with in-house effectively and to the satisfaction of the RWC officials - it would be bizarre to suggest that England chose the Romania match as the one which they feared sufficiently to require cheating, surely?

Tindall should go as he adds nothing to the proceedings and Flood should replace him.

I'm no fan of Tindall, but that's a little unfair (his defence is very strong, for example) - although Flood has played there occasionally, he isn't really a centre so isn't a likely replacement. Centre has been a problem position for England for a few years now and Tindall probably shades it as the least bad option in the squad.

Good luck against Ireland next week - should be the pick of the Q-final matches.

[DracoM]

England play FRANCE in Q-finals, Ireland play Wales.

[Anna]

Not glossed over, just a mistake dealt with in-house effectively and to the satisfaction of the RWC officials - it would be bizarre to suggest that England chose the Romania match as the one which they feared sufficiently to require cheating, surely?

No, not a mistake at all. It was deliberate and, if it had not been spotted by some commentators on the pitch and the substitute No. 4 ball, not the original ball, had in the end been used England could have been banned or fined a hefty amount. The reason for the attempted switch is simple. Wilkinson's success rate had been around 50%, his two coaches wanted the switch to boost his confidence as he thought he'd lost his ability to place the ball squarely over the bar. So, to switch during the Romania match was ideal as it wouldn't affect England winning. Suppose the switch had been made during the Scotland match when England were trailing? All hell would have broken loose and England, rightly, would have been ejected from the competition. Cheating is cheating even though his coaches may have had the best of (misguided) intentions. Unfortunately for so long England, when slipping or needing a boost, have wheeled Wilkinson out from the bench to save them like some lucky mascot.

"Utimately there was a breach of the laws of the game,” said Johnson. “But it has happened, some action has been taken, and we have to move on.” How many times on this tour has Johnson had to say "we have to move on" Is there another WC Team who has had off-pitch misbehaviour, didn't the shame of 2008 and weeks of dodging police questioning make any impression? They are, after all, ambassadors for their country and the sport aren't they?

Well it seems that Armitage has a one-week ban and for France Estebanez has a three-week ban for dangerous tackling. Cueto will be in in place of Armitage. What a shame, the way things have worked out, that Ireland have to play Wales, the two best Northern hemisphere teams and one has to go.

[Norfolk Born]

Of the Northern Hemisphere teams left, only Ireland look capable of causing a further upset.