BBC4 Under Threat .. Thompson must go!

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

Yet the BBC, who have 117 executive staff paid more than the £142,500 earned by the Prime Minister, spent £8.2million hiring management consultants.

A total of £2.5million went on IT consultants, £1.3million on finance experts and £1million on business processes advice.

from the murdoch vitriol but nonetheless revealing

[Paul Sherratt]

They're just a load of jammy dodgers.






Declaration:
I have been the recipient of a R3 Womad coverage 10th Birthday celebration daiquiri.

[amateur51]

I very much agree with Calum's opening post about Mark Thompson. I would say he has a powerful claim to be the worst DG in the BBC's history (though John Birt is a very close rival for that title).

Oh I'd put in a word for Michael Checkland too - he was the original BBC bean-counter.

A story goes of Checkland walking to his car outside Broadcasting House. En route he is stopped by a gentleman-of-the-road making an emergency funding request.

"Fifty pee for a cuppa tea, squire? I'm homeless and skint"

"Really? says Checkland, slowing down

"Yes guv"

"How long have you been homeless?"

"Three years this April, mate"

"Fascinating - what was your financial position this time last year?" asks Checkland, spinning the combination lock on his purse

[Serial_Apologist]

> the apprentice is a dreadful example for all the petty tyrants and egotistic idiots who do run real businesses ... <

agreed. i have never watched a whole programme, but have plenty of experience of its negative effects on peoples' behaviour.

real businesses aside, alan sugar sets an even worse example to people in community orgs, who are now encouraged to set up businesses, and on a collective basis, in the name of 'handing back power to communities'.

having written a constitution, and stated collective objectives, people then tend to revert to 'sugar mode', and eg 'fire' anyone who they personally disagree with, on any particular topic...(neighbour disputes included)!

as a mentality, sugar's is very destructive to communities imo. especially as funding money does not go to individuals ..but to constituted organisations, with a committee, and members. ime tv generated ideas about 'autonomy', 'individualism', and 'personal charisma' do not get collective orgs anywhere at all, other than to help disband them.

anyone, from bad tempered grans, to moody youths ...now think they have access to a lot of 'rules', courtesy of alan sugar, that are actually totally alien to the voluntary sector, and small enterprises. in addition, with many community activities/services being withdrawn/cut, it's important that other methods encouraged as 'replacements' actually work! (or so you'd think)

besides, i should imagine much of what sugar does on tv, is fictional, for entertainment/(his) career purposes. 'the apprentice' should ideally clearly state this on the packet imo.

it's also an especially tactless, hollow title, since real apprenticeships have never ever been more inaccessable to uk people, unfortunately.

as far as thompson goes, someone is directing/influencing his wrecking spree ... he can't have thought it all up on his own, surely? however, it's still awful to live through, and witness, no matter who initiated what amounts to pretty regressive, grotesque changes in beeb objectives.

I was actually thinking more about the recruits - some of whom claimed actually to have run their own successful businesses - than Sugar; but I take your points, Handsomefortune and Calum; I should have resorted to the irony emoticon!

(Btw I posted this or a very similar message on here an hour ago - wonder what became of it?)

[Serial_Apologist]

Oh I'd put in a word for Michael Checkland too - he was the original BBC bean-counter.

A story goes of Checkland walking to his car outside Broadcasting House. En route he is stopped by a gentleman-of-the-road making an emergency funding request.

"Fifty pee for a cuppa tea, squire? I'm homeless and skint"

"Really? says Checkland, slowing down

"Yes guv"

"How long have you been homeless?"

"Three years this April, mate"

"Fascinating - what was your financial position this time last year?" asks Checkland, spinning the combination lock on his purse

Checkland by name, Checkland by nature

[Norfolk Born]

[QUOTE=Paul Sherratt;76220]They're just a load of jammy dodgers.



This sort of comment really takes the biscuit.

Declaration: the manager of our local Red Cross Shop gave my wife, who is a volunteer there, a donated electric kettle on hearing that our jug kettle was kaputt. I have used said gift on a number of occasions.

[Anna]

"BBC English Regions spent £1,868 last year on chocolate digestives, bourbons, shortcake and oatmeal biscuits, while BBC Wales spent £150 just on chocolate digestives" !!!

There's so much of interest (well, to me anyway) on BBC4 that never seems to be trailed or publicised. Last night was the first of four programmes on British Pathé which included live coverage of the Siege of Sidney Street, (ok, I love old archive footage) but it was a fascinating programme about the development of news coverage. Next episode is about the voices of Pathé

[Lateralthinking1]

Various -

MT

I just don't like MT. It isn't just the policies. I find him a truly horrid, peculiar and revolting person.

Biscuits

We probably spent getting on for £1,000 of staff time in my old place discussing whether visitors should be given biscuits. It went up to the very highest levels for consideration. This was by request as they wanted to show that they were seriously in touch.

In this initiative, the aspiring on the upward curve showed remarkable dexterity in balancing an unconvinced giggly school childism with a post-war turn of phrase : "Now come along, we must discuss this properly because honestly every penny counts". Middle England sighs from me in the corner were enough to paint me as some old irrelevant revolutionary red.

Apprentice

The Apprentice. Even as a kid, I never chose Amstrad. I made it very clear to my parents that given a choice at Christmas between one of their tower units and bread and dripping I would choose the latter. They had a better chance of surviving into the new year.

Consequently, I was given a slightly more expensive Japanese thing of some quality but considerably fewer components given its relative cost. I was happy with it. At least it never fell apart in the same way as Buckaroo and Haunted House.

[Frances_iom]

Declaration: the manager of our local Red Cross Shop gave my wife, who is a volunteer there, a donated electric kettle on hearing that our jug kettle was kaputt. I have used said gift on a number of occasions.

well they couldn't sell it under elf + safety regs

[amateur51]

"BBC English Regions spent £1,868 last year on chocolate digestives, bourbons, shortcake and oatmeal biscuits, while BBC Wales spent £150 just on chocolate digestives" !!!

Crumbs!

[Frances_iom]

They're just a load of jammy dodgers.
Declaration:
I have been the recipient of a R3 Womad coverage 10th Birthday celebration daiquiri.

very appropriate a tarted up Americanised version of navy grog from the 1790's(which had the lime juice - hence 'limeys') presented as ethnic chic - just like world pap.

[handsomefortune]

thanks for this reflection pmartel, though it's shame that canadians are apparently in the same boat, already.

> No different in Canada.

CBC Radio 2 cut it's all classical format about 3 years ago. It's now a complete mix of crap.

As for tv here, SEVEN HOURS of kiddy programming in the morning and THEN repeats of the day before tv shows including Wheel of Fortune and Jeopardy. and THIS is from our public broadcaster in Canada.

Just to let you know you are not alone <


to an extent doesnt the above post illustrate that thompson is working to global media objectives?

who doesn't recognise 'a complex mix of crap'?

or, huge emphasis on entertaining 0-10 yr olds?

or, tv/radio repeats being more likely than not?

what we don't know about canadian public broadcasting is whether a total zero, such as thompson, is still lurking, intent on shaving yet more bits off what's left? meanwhile, he pockets big wonga himself, thompson having been (allegedly) 'forced' to deliver 'swingeing cuts' to high quality, time honoured programming, (incredibly) because of 'lack of cash'?

evidently, it's certainly not just 'news corp' who are responsible for 'coarsening culture'.

however, i can't quite get into the frame of mind to 'hate the beeb', as required by 'the sun' article.

obviously, witholding license fees is potentially a bit of an own goal in the longterm? as is lumping thompson in with less self serving people, remaining in beeb posts, despite cuts. (if such people still exist), if only they would blow the whistle, and long and loud, preferably before their jobs are cut. rather than complaints about beeb 'progress' being routinely subverted, or totally ignored, especially by the beeb, (and government).

instead, we seem powerless, have to make do, glimpsing news of internal 'goings on', in beeb journos striking. the beeb (apparently) not wanting to give nuj members 'preferential treatment' ....whatever that is meant to mean. guessing, between the lines, nuj members (presumably) insisted on standards of journalism that the beeb's not prepared to pay for? not any more at least, the same as regards canada ....and increasingly, probably the rest of the west.

a shame adam curtis tends to do retrospective documentaries..... as by then, it'll longsince be too late.

[pmartel]

Hi handsomefortune;

Yes, we started noticing things about 3 years ago. Our radio network had some of the best programming around. Things slowly started changing and the crunch came when CBC killed off all FULL Classical programming on radio.

We were totally up in arms and as usual, this was a 'my way or the highway' approach.

Since the change, I have NOT listened to CBC Radio 2 NOR do I hardly EVER watch the tv network. It has become a total laughing stock for this country.

As I said in my post, imagine running almost 7hrs of kiddy programming in the morning on tv and BAD kiddy programming at that.

We are just so frustrated at everything. At one point I came up with the idea of an online network purely for the arts in this country as that may be the only way to go.

While some complained my idea would alienate those without computers, it would be made up for in world wide listernship if the site was set up properly.

This may be the eventual route to go in the arts industry in this country

[Lateralthinking1]

pmartel - I was very interested, and horrified, to hear the news you bring from Canada. It helps to place what is happening here in more perspective but suggests a wider, deeper malaise. That feeling of what exactly is the international agenda and why - maybe David Icke does have a point! - and the parallel one of "oh, there is nowhere else to turn to?".

handsomefortune - I probably agree with all of your comments below, including regrettably the first bit if the suggestion that fees would be withheld didn't save BBC4. However, there is a dilemma here, isn't there? For those of us who would find that there isn't anything we wanted to watch on television, are we being asked to volunteer to pay the FULL annual fee simply to safeguard the excellent R3 and R4? This doesn't seem fair to me although they know how far people would go to keep them.

"Obviously, witholding license fees is potentially a bit of an own goal in the longterm? as is lumping thompson in with less self serving people, remaining in beeb posts, despite cuts. (if such people still exist), if only they would blow the whistle, and long and loud, preferably before their jobs are cut. rather than complaints about beeb 'progress' being routinely subverted, or totally ignored, especially by the beeb, (and government). instead, we seem powerless, have to make do, glimpsing news of internal 'goings on'"

[pmartel]

Lateralthinking1, I love the comment 'is there no where to turn'

This is why I have opted to to put forth the idea of an alternative QUALITY network.

Here in Toronto, there is a supposed option, BUT it plays primarily 'pop' classical and WAY too much talk AND WORSE, COMMERCIALS. This is the current state of affairs in this country.

In the U.S, Public Radio is also taking a big hit, so it appears that broadcasting of the arts is going through a 'dumbing down' phase.

Years ago, our CBC TV network was superb, it was actually televising and simulcasting classical concerts on tv and FM radio.

When I was growing up, I remember watching a LIVE televised performance of 'Sleeping Beauty' by the National Ballet of Canada, this was back in the '70's. Now, absolutely nothing, but the lowest common denomniator and this is what our taxes go towards