Riots

[Mr Pee]

Not sure I have ever read anything more eloquent, comprehensive or thought-provoking on these boards

Hilarious, Caliban!! You are a wag!!

[Ferretfancy]

A few years ago I was on jury service at Wood Green. Two local lads were accused of passing forged tenners. During the case it transpired that some of these notes had turned up in the till at the police canteen! One boy was apprehended while hiding under a parked car, and the money was supposed to be stuffed in the back pocket of his jeans, the other in a supermarket where he was buying a can of Guinness and chips for his dad's breakfast.
We were shown the forged notes, they were flawlessly clean and crisp as if just off the press. Crumpled in the back of his jeans while lying under an oily car ? We did not think so. In the police car glove box while they drove around the area looking for likely suspects ? Much more believable. One of the two policeman did not give evidence, and in the absence of written statements we gave a not guilty verdict.
These boys were certainly not saints, but lads like them are endlessly stopped and questioned, and they all accuse the police of planting evidence. The other boy was subsequently found guilty of possessing a minute amount of cannabis found by the officers in a vase on his dad's mantlepiece and find £200. Coincidence?
Incidents like these over many years produce a seething resentment, and truth and falsehood become totally entangled, so that even well meaning parents do not know what to believe when listening to their kids.
What has happened in the last few days is not forgivable, but there are numerous factors that go towards explaining it.

[Nick Armstrong]

Incidentally, there is a wonderful description of the Bullingdon Club in Evelyn Waugh's 'Decline and Fall'. Even though the novel was first published in 1928 their behaviour is startlingly similar to what was reported to be going on during Cameron's/Johnson's/Osborne's years at Oxford.

Is that the one with the quote about the characteristic sound "of the English county families baying for broken glass" ??

[eighthobstruction]

Ferret....I think 'seething resentment' is a bit of an abstract concept....there's visceral reaction here, mixed with uninformed reasoning....

[Nick Armstrong]

Hilarious, Caliban!! You are a wag!!

[Lateralthinking1]

Waugh in 1928 is probably pertinent given that the Great Depression started in 1929.

[scottycelt]

Now at last we are getting some sort of meaningful picture of some of those pleading guilty and therefore indisputably involved in the London riots ... it'll be interesting to finally get an exact proportion of those with jobs compared to those without?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14478063

[Nick Armstrong]

Per: The Daily Telegraph rolling coverage:

"Ed Miliband faced heckles during a walkabout in Manchester earlier. A large crowd gathered around him and his entourage as they toured the city centre. One man shouted: "All platitudes, Dave, as usual. You are all the same." Not clear whether he was mistaken for David Cameron or his elder brother, David Miliband."

[Anna]

On a lighter note, there has been a lot of clever work done to photos of the looting. OK, you may think some of it in bad taste in such serious times, but there are 3 pages of them here (scroll down), some of them hilarious

http://photoshoplooter.tumblr.com/

[Lateralthinking1]

....for everyone's benefit, I am going to shut up for a few hours. However, as I strolled in Caterham town centre this morning - sunshine, everyone particularly polite, an absolute picture of normality but without the usual pushing and shoving - part of me thought "isn't this lovely". It was a small part.

I feel in my blood and in my bones that a line here has been crossed that is as momentous as the moon landings. It signifies below the calm exterior the absolute collapse of this country's organisational framework. This is the beginning of an absolute nightmare from hell.

We won't see too many changes rapidly. But it is a bleaker place than anywhere anyone born post-1945 has lived in and it is going to be dire beyond anyone's current comprehension. When my parents go, I have decided. I will be getting the first plane out.

[Chris Newman]

Thinking of Evelyn Waugh's wonderful characterisation in his satires reminds me of my days as a student when we thought Mrs T's manner as Minister of Education warranted the nickname the Honourable Mrs Margot Beste-Chetwynde.

[Globaltruth]

In the interest of balance, the riot cleanup action is an encouraging development (although the logical progression to vigilantism is somewhat more disturbing yet inevitable).

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-14475741

I saw this develop on Twitter, groups of people quickly taking ownership for their respective geographic areas. A few points:

1 The Manchester clean-up was being organised as the riot there was taking place.

2 The chief organiser has made a couple of pleas to the media not to put any spin on their actions (and Boris' broom action was of course just band-wagon-jumpingly gruesome), just to let them get on with it, and also to the police to actually let them through the cordons to get on with the work.

3 Wayne Rooney and Rio Ferdinand were invited to take part to send a message, they didn't but offered support.

Here's the link

http://twitter.com/#!/search?q=%23riotcleanup

and the Top Tweet:
Employee from Waterstones Manchester: "We'll stay open. If they steal some books they might learn something." #riotcleanup


PS remember the internet gave us this, not Cameron D & The Big Society

[Serial_Apologist]

....for everyone's benefit, I am going to shut up for a few hours. However, as I strolled in Caterham town centre this morning - sunshine, everyone particularly polite, an absolute picture of normality but without the usual pushing and shoving - part of me thought "isn't this lovely". It was a small part.

I feel in my blood and in my bones that a line here has been crossed that is as momentous as the moon landings. It signifies below the calm exterior the absolute collapse of this country's organisational framework. This is the beginning of an absolute nightmare from hell.

We won't see too many changes rapidly. But it is a bleaker place than anywhere anyone born post-1945 has lived in and it is going to be dire beyond anyone's current comprehension. When my parents go, I have decided. I will be getting the first plane out.

I noted something similar among my fellow humans out there trying to find a shop open yesterday afternoon, Lat. A lot more friendly eye-contact between strangers - and I live in quite a friendly district.

The problem might be: the first plane out to where? Norway? I doubt with a probable MI5 file one'd even be allowed in!

[Stillhomewardbound]

Here's a verbatim record of that Gove / Harman head-to:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/wintour-and-watt/2011/aug/10/michaelgove-harrietharman

I'm surprised to read that Harman is 61 and Gove 43. Are those ages the right way around.

[eighthobstruction]

Those photo's Anna, ....very very very funny....exceedingly quick and sharp....