Finding TV channels and programmes - sometimes too complicated

[Dave2002]

Rumour has it that there's something called Zen on the Drama channel tonight. I have no idea how to find this. We have Netflix, Prime and satellite dish which can find many Freesat channels. We don't have Freeview. The program guides are hopeless. Various suggestions for channel numbers - 20, 143 - none of them work.

I guess this is something we're going to miss, but heck - things don't have to be this useless and complicated.

[Dave2002]

It's another capitalistic privacy "scam" - legal in so-called democracies. Yes - after a great deal of effort one discovers that in order to get to the scheduled programme one has to download an app - I found I could do that on our Roku stick. Then you have to register on a computer or tablet and then link a code to the TV. Then, after that, you'll be subjected to a torrent of adverts you probably either don't want to watch, or you may have already got or used the products or services shown. Finally - one might - with a fair wind - actually get to see a programme.

In the meantime you will have given up your email address, given a postcode which identifies your location to within 500 metres - and opened up yet another lot of records on commercial and other databases which are tracking you and your behaviour.

Sure - it's (eventually) free to watch, but very invasive re data collection. Back to the notion of "You are the product".

Not good .......

[Nick Armstrong]

Blimey. Glad I stuck with Freeview (with Netflix & Prime on the side)

[Petrushka]

Zen is on channel 20, the Drama channel, on Freeview. I found it within 5 seconds.

I've only got Freeview and that's more than enough for the amount of television I watch which consists mostly of the Saturday afternoon racing plus occasional bits on Sky Arts and Talking Pictures. Freeview listings are in TV guides or on the channel's own website: https://drama.uktv.co.uk/ You might be a be to watch Zen on demand on UKTV Play once tonight's episode has finished.

[Nick Armstrong]

Zen is on channel 20, the Drama channel, on Freeview. I found it within 5 seconds.

I've only got Freeview and that's more than enough for the amount of television I watch which consists mostly of the Saturday afternoon racing plus occasional bits on Sky Arts and Talking Pictures. Freeview listings are in TV guides or on the channel's own website: https://drama.uktv.co.uk/ You might be a be to watch Zen on demand on UKTV Play once tonight's episode has finished.

Unfortunately Dave specified he doesn’t have Freeview...

[alywin]

I didn't realise it was possible not to have Freeview ...

[Petrushka]

Unfortunately Dave specified he doesn’t have Freeview...

He doesn't need to have Freeview on his TV if he watches it on demand on his computer/laptop. He'll just need to register.

Update: Zen is on there now to watch on demand! https://uktvplay.uktv.co.uk/shows/

[Dave2002]

I didn't realise it was possible not to have Freeview ...

It is if the terrestrial reception is so poor you’d need an antenna array similar to some of the ones at Goonhilly or other listening stations. I gave up trying to get terrestrial digital TV working. I believe an aerial expert could do it, but it would cost a lot more than it would be worth in terms of time spent and equipment bought, so we just do online and Freesat. Freesat and Freeview are not quite the same thing. I used to assume they were more or less the same, but they’re not quite.

[LHC]

According to the Drama channel’s website, it is on channel 158 on Freesat.

[Dave2002]

According to the Drama channel’s website, it is on channel 158 on Freesat.

Try telling our TV that. It thinks that's R5L (Radio 5 Live). We explored most of the options - including 158 - none of them worked.
As my rant in msg 2 indicates, I was able to get to the channel using our Roku stick, installing the UKTV app, and then registering. The point about the rant is that it allows someone/some bodies to build up a profile of me and my family. They know where I live to within a small number of metres. They know what road it is, what the demographic is in the area, they know my email address. They can (and almost certainly will) cross reference that against other data bases. They know my age - since registration includes date of birth. Arguably they gather all this information "to help me" - which is a euphemism for targeting adverts to me via the communications channels, and possibly worse than that, such as trying to infer my political and other views, and later manipulate those.

In case anyone in the UK doesn't know, it is technically possible to target adverts down to street level, or maybe even individual houses. So a street with a many dog owners will get more adverts for dog food, while an area with high value property or high income earners is more likely to get adverts for expensive cars and more long distance holidays than are good for the environment. That level of manipulation can also be extended to trying to manipulate our thought processes, by suggesting other programmes we might want to watch.

Of course it's a free (capitalist) country, so just as I am free to choose what I want to do, so the businesses are free to choose how they try to manipulate my purchases and my thought processes. In case anyone doubts it, I mostly dislike TV with adverts, as indeed any form of advertising attached to information sources I want to use - though sadly it is also the case that many useful services would not be viable without a modicum of advertising.

[LHC]

Try telling our TV that. It thinks that's R5L (Radio 5 Live). We explored most of the options - including 158 - none of them worked.
As my rant in msg 2 indicates, I was able to get to the channel using our Roku stick, installing the UKTV app, and then registering. The point about the rant is that it allows someone/some bodies to build up a profile of me and my family. They know where I live to within a small number of metres. They know what road it is, what the demographic is in the area, they know my email address. They can (and almost certainly will) cross reference that against other data bases. They know my age - since registration includes date of birth. Arguably they gather all this information "to help me" - which is a euphemism for targeting adverts to me via the communications channels, and possibly worse than that, such as trying to infer my political and other views, and later manipulate those.

In case anyone in the UK doesn't know, it is technically possible to target adverts down to street level, or maybe even individual houses. So a street with a many dog owners will get more adverts for dog food, while an area with high value property or high income earners is more likely to get adverts for expensive cars and more long distance holidays than are good for the environment. That level of manipulation can also be extended to trying to manipulate our thought processes, by suggesting other programmes we might want to watch.

Of course it's a free (capitalist) country, so just as I am free to choose what I want to do, so the businesses are free to choose how they try to manipulate my purchases and my thought processes. In case anyone doubts it, I mostly dislike TV with adverts, as indeed any form of advertising attached to information sources I want to use - though sadly it is also the case that many useful services would not be viable without a modicum of advertising.

If the Drama channel wasn’t showing up on the appropriate channel number, perhaps you need to retune and update the channel listings on your Freesat box.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Try telling our TV that. It thinks that's R5L (Radio 5 Live). We explored most of the options - including 158 - none of them worked.
As my rant in msg 2 indicates, I was able to get to the channel using our Roku stick, installing the UKTV app, and then registering. The point about the rant is that it allows someone/some bodies to build up a profile of me and my family. They know where I live to within a small number of metres. They know what road it is, what the demographic is in the area, they know my email address. They can (and almost certainly will) cross reference that against other data bases. They know my age - since registration includes date of birth. Arguably they gather all this information "to help me" - which is a euphemism for targeting adverts to me via the communications channels, and possibly worse than that, such as trying to infer my political and other views, and later manipulate those.

In case anyone in the UK doesn't know, it is technically possible to target adverts down to street level, or maybe even individual houses. So a street with a many dog owners will get more adverts for dog food, while an area with high value property or high income earners is more likely to get adverts for expensive cars and more long distance holidays than are good for the environment. That level of manipulation can also be extended to trying to manipulate our thought processes, by suggesting other programmes we might want to watch.

Of course it's a free (capitalist) country, so just as I am free to choose what I want to do, so the businesses are free to choose how they try to manipulate my purchases and my thought processes. In case anyone doubts it, I mostly dislike TV with adverts, as indeed any form of advertising attached to information sources I want to use - though sadly it is also the case that many useful services would not be viable without a modicum of advertising.

Although it is technically possible for a tv / net company to target ads to that level using street level postcode demo data I can tell you for a fact that it almost certainly doesn’t happen - it’s just too expensive . What does happen on the net is targeting based on your previous searches . If you disable / reject cookies or just wipe them that’s quite effective. You could try switching off your sat box and reloading the channels . You have to be careful with the more obscure channels .On DTT which I use some channels aren’t on the local multiplex at all - like BBC Four HD for example.

[oddoneout]

If the Drama channel wasn’t showing up on the appropriate channel number, perhaps you need to retune and update the channel listings on your Freesat box.

I do that when prompted by Freeview, although with some trepidation because it often gets stuck at "42% complete" and then I can't watch anything at all without a prolonged period of switching everything off and on to poke it back into life. However after the latest such episode I now have one channel that I can't find at all, as the published number(Freeview online) brings up something else altogether (not a problem as such since it was only one that I wanted to try out rather than one I watch regularly), and two channels I do watch I can only get by using their 'old' numbers as the published new 'ones' don't even bring up another channel , just an error message, and an occasional channel I have managed to track down. I think it's possibly all part of my equipment being too old(by today's standards) and before too long I may end up with the digibox not working at all, and no hope of a new one working with my 'ancient' TV. For now I've memorised the 2 alternatives and put a note on my noticeboard about lost or changed ones less frequently used.

[Ein Heldenleben]

I do that when prompted by Freeview, although with some trepidation because it often gets stuck at "42% complete" and then I can't watch anything at all without a prolonged period of switching everything off and on to poke it back into life. However after the latest such episode I now have one channel that I can't find at all, as the published number(Freeview online) brings up something else altogether (not a problem as such since it was only one that I wanted to try out rather than one I watch regularly), and two channels I do watch I can only get by using their 'old' numbers as the published new 'ones' don't even bring up another channel , just an error message, and an occasional channel I have managed to track down. I think it's possibly all part of my equipment being too old(by today's standards) and before too long I may end up with the digibox not working at all, and no hope of a new one working with my 'ancient' TV. For now I've memorised the 2 alternatives and put a note on my noticeboard about lost or changed ones less frequently used.

It’s probably because the channels on you local DTT multiplex have changed - about a year ago a lot were unceremoniously kicked off to make way for 4 and 5 G . If you enter your postcode into this it should tell you what channels are available .

https://www.freeview.co.uk/help/coverage-checker-results

Note that there are SD and HD versions of some of channels One complication is that you may be ,for local reasons ( building / hill shadows), taking a signal off a different transmitter - the quickest way to check is to look at which way your aerial is pointing.To work out what that aerial is ask a local aerial engineer then enter a post code from a street where you know the majority of people are using that transmitter. There are huge swathes of the country where people have choice e.g. Taunton / Oxford . Once met a lorry driver in Wincanton who had three aerials and could pick up ITV West (Bristol) , ITV South and , amazingly, ITV Westcountry possibly off Honiton or a nearer repeater.

Ps if it’s a sat box I can’t help you !

[Dave2002]

Although it is technically possible for a tv / net company to target ads to that level using street level postcode demo data I can tell you for a fact that it almost certainly doesn’t happen - it’s just too expensive . What does happen on the net is targeting based on your previous searches . If you disable / reject cookies or just wipe them that’s quite effective. You could try switching off your sat box and reloading the channels . You have to be careful with the more obscure channels .On DTT which I use some channels aren’t on the local multiplex at all - like BBC Four HD for example.

Re demographically targetted adverts it does happen in the USA, and has been happening for decades. Also, there has been a very significant business in the UK for years of databases of customer behaviour and preferences - not just TV watching and media consumption, which has been going since before the end of the last century. It's not accidental, and presumably makes money for some. I don't think it's too expensive for those trying to profit from that.

You may be right that I need to retune the satellite channels on the TV. Mostly I don't need to bother though, as I don't really care what the numbers are as long as the programs are there - but if it does make a difference to the numbering - something I'm not at all sure or convinced of - then I'll give that a try.