Vaccines and Other Musings...

[richardfinegold]

Finally got my first vaccination last night. There have been many distribution issues here. The first batches were delivered to Hospital based systems only. The Clinic I work for has eight locations and several hundred employees and we are not directly owned by a Hospital Network so we weren't eligible. This is despite the fact that we have done over 20,000 tests and have a 30% positivity rate at my location.
My wife, a Nurse at University of Chicago Hospital, was one of the first vaccinated. I got my first dose last night and she is getting number two this morning. The only reason that I got mine is that an email at her job went out a few days saying hey we have lots of extra, does anyone have a family member who is a Clinician and can't obtain one at the moment, so after a brief application period I Wass accepted. Otoh, our Chief Medical Officer has had several meetings with U of C about our employees being vaccinated by them and they have not approved, despite having not used 3/4 of the allotment that they were given. There was a Chicago Tribune story about this a few days ago, featuring many quotes from a researcher at U of C with no clinical contact who was surprised when they offered it to her on the first day of availability. Our main Clinic location is 1 block from U of C Hospital, and the Hospital ER routinely shunts their overflow to that location, from which they become dispersed throughout our Clinic system. So while we take many of the sick Covid Patients, we can't get the vaccine. I slipped in a crack of their bureaucracy, and I am grateful, but my coworkers at this time have no idea when they will receive it.
I realize the rest of the country is in a similar boat, that it is maddening to want it, hear about others getting it and not having any idea when it will arrive.

[french frank]

The only reason that I got mine is that an email at her job went out a few days saying hey we have lots of extra, does anyone have a family member who is a Clinician and can't obtain one at the moment, so after a brief application period I Wass accepted.

That situation repeated elsewhere https://www.salon.com/2021/01/07/why...united-states/

I get my first this afternoon, and am commanded to show up OR ELSE (the dose will be wasted).

[Cockney Sparrow]

I think Richard's situation has occurred here - press reports particulatly for the Pfizer vaccine because all the doses in the "pizza Box" have to be used at the location the immunisation started, and at once. Also from a TV item, the nurses said the vials contain an extra dose than stated (IIRC 6 instead of 5). So they put the word out to nearby NHS facilities where staff can come over immediately to take the vaccine.

Mrs CS is tapped into a local source of news, council related, and heard that our local immunisation facility at a sports centre location had queues of over 80 year old's in cars (at least she was sure they weren't being asked to queue outside) waiting up to 4 hours one day recently because their internet access went down and paperwork had to be substituted. The severity of that might be overstated in the telling - I don't know; it is a difficut logisitical exercise being done with an aim of great speed - but it does illustrate there are difficulties to be ironed out as the mass rollout gets underway.

[Dave2002]

I have seen this guy's videos before. They appear to make sense, but are they not perhaps really "fake news"? Should they be banned? I don't know.
If people watch the video, I recommend they treat it with caution regarding their own actions. It is interesting, but what are the author's credentials?

One of his basic beliefs, which he claims is shown up in data, is that lockdowns have almost no effect. This is in disagreement with statements put out by government scientists and medical experts.
So who are we to believe?

There is some agreement with official statements. For example, it is not always claimed that lockdowns prevent cases - though that seems inuitively obvious - but that they do reduce the immediate day to day impact on health systems. They might broaden and flatten peaks, so that hospitals don't get overloaded.

Whether total excess deaths in each year are not affected I'm not in a position to judge.

Currently some in my family (they don't live near) have the disease, and the message is that it's very unpleasant - completely debilitating. I will be happy to try to avoid this for as long as possible, and if you call that a pointless lockdown, so be it. Cases have gone up quite rapidly in our area recently. I have no intention of deliberately going out to mingle and possibly catching the disease. If I get it accidentally - well that's another matter - but I'm doing as much as I can at present to avoid contact with others who might pass it to me and those in our household.

[Serial_Apologist]

That situation repeated elsewhere https://www.salon.com/2021/01/07/why...united-states/

I get my first this afternoon, and am commanded to show up OR ELSE (the dose will be wasted).

Pleased to hear that, ff. Nothing heard as yet at this end, although, being on a permanent prescription for heart disease and over 75, I must be considered in the top priority range? A representative from "an NHS surgery in Dulwich" - which must be around here, said on the local lunchtime news on Wednesday that they had not yet received, or, surprisingly, had notice or receiving the vac. I had thought to ask the chemist this morning when I picked up my supply whether they were to be included in the vaccination programme, but thought it best not to ask: the poor dears are up to their eyeballs at the mo, yet seemed in remarkably good spirits, as always, no one there having contracted the virus thus far.

[Serial_Apologist]

I have seen this guy's videos before. They appear to make sense, but are they not perhaps really "fake news"? Should they be banned? I don't know.
If people watch the video, I recommend they treat it with caution regarding their own actions. It is interesting, but what are the author's credentials?

One of his basic beliefs, which he claims is shown up in data, is that lockdowns have almost no effect. This is in disagreement with statements put out by government scientists and medical experts.
So who are we to believe?

There is some agreement with official statements. For example, it is not always claimed that lockdowns prevent cases - though that seems inuitively obvious - but that they do reduce the immediate day to day impact on health systems. They might broaden and flatten peaks, so that hospitals don't get overloaded.

Whether total excess deaths in each year are not affected I'm not in a position to judge.

Currently some in my family (they don't live near) have the disease, and the message is that it's very unpleasant - completely debilitating. I will be happy to try to avoid this for as long as possible, and if you call that a pointless lockdown, so be it. Cases have gone up quite rapidly in our area recently. I have no intention of deliberately going out to mingle and possibly catching the disease. If I get it accidentally - well that's another matter - but I'm doing as much as I can at present to avoid contact with others who might pass it to me and those in our household.

With 1 in 30 actually now having the virus in London, and Mayor Sadiq Khan declaring a major incident for the whole of London in the past hour, one feels like a sitting duck. While still assuming keeping my physical distance and handwashing on returning from shopping to be enough for safety, on Monday we had Sarah Jarvis, the TV doctor, telling us that handwashing, masking and social distancing are no longer enough with the new variant, I now find myself masking up all the time outside when others are about, and on calm days such as this one staying well away from others, given that it now seems that the virus is capable of lingering in the air. My local surgery is within 10 minutes' walk - I may just toddle down there later and see if any notices have been posted outside the entrance.

[Pulcinella]

Another petition that forum members might want to add their voice to:

Prioritise teachers, school and childcare staff for Covid-19 vaccination

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/554316

[french frank]

So who are we to believe?

Not Ivor Cummins.

[Serial_Apologist]

Another petition that forum members might want to add their voice to:

Prioritise teachers, school and childcare staff for Covid-19 vaccination

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/554316

Is it not the case that teachers and staff at classes for pre-puberty children are at minimal risk of catching Covid-19 from their charges?

[Pulcinella]

Is it not the case that teachers and staff at classes for pre-puberty children are at minimal risk of catching Covid-19 from their charges?

I think that the jury may well still be out on that, S_A.
I, for one, would be happy for the primary school teacher I worked with to get his jab before me; I'd just hole up a little bit longer, knowing that he might be safer.

[Serial_Apologist]

I think the the jury may well still be out on that, S_A.
I, for one, would be happy for the primary school teacher I worked with to get his jab before me; I'd just hole up a little bit longer, knowing that he might be safer.

Yes indeed - and if as you say the jury still is out on that one, so would I. Really I am incredibly lucky as compared with others (especially those living in this block who have to work on Covid wards), being able to stay indoors, engaging with this forum, listening to recordings and watching TV and DVDs, or going out for the hour's walk or exercise we're now allowed when not shopping, which is only needed twice a week.

[french frank]

I, for one, would be happy for the primary school teacher I worked with to get his jab before me; I'd just hole up a little bit longer, knowing that he might be safer.

I had a similar thought. I'm well catered for without leaving my home, except for a solitary walk now and again. And I have no thoughts of changing that when I'm fully vaccinated - because I don't have to.

(Arm is feeling a tiny bit achy, but all ran impressively smoothly this afternoon. I was "done" as soon as I arrived and had been checked in - 15 mins early - and the longest wait was the 15 minutes afterwards, clutching my compulsory issue of timer until it bleeped and I was allowed to leave.)

[Dave2002]

Not Ivor Cummins.

Here is one video critical of Ivor Cummins - https://youtu.be/9IooQAJAXCE

There are probably more but I haven't found them yet. This one doesn't pass on or reinforce any overly reckless messages.

[french frank]

Here is one video critical of Ivor Cummins - https://youtu.be/9IooQAJAXCE

There are probably more but I haven't found them yet. This one doesn't pass on or reinforce any overly reckless messages.

Here's the Full Fact conclusion, including on Ivor Cummins.

"Some science supports Mr Cummins on some points, in other words, but a great deal—which he does not mention—contradicts him."

[Bryn]

Here's the Full Fact conclusion, including on Ivor Cummins.

"Some science supports Mr Cummins on some points, in other words, but a great deal—which he does not mention—contradicts him."

The point about the timing of the gap from the imposed lockdown and the fall in the rate of deaths is well made. I put myself in effective lockdown from March 9th, well before it became obligatory, for instance.