Ties

[doversoul1]

Men should be thankful to have suit and ties to fall back on when they need to be in a work situation where their personalities and characters don’t come into. What to wear at/for work is the biggest headache for women, especially for freelancers. You can talk about equality etc. until cows come home, but women are judged, often initially, by what they are wearing. It’s not always a serious issue but it is something that most working women dare not or cannot afford to ignore.

[Old Grumpy]

Men should be thankful to have suit and ties to fall back on when they need to be in a work situation where their personalities and characters don’t come into. What to wear at/for work is the biggest headache for women, especially for freelancers. You can talk about equality etc. until cows come home, but women are judged, often initially, by what they are wearing. It’s not always a serious issue but it is something that most working women dare not or cannot afford to ignore.

But don't fall back on your tie, you could end up strangling yourself!

[teamsaint]

So here we are, the 1st Night of the Proms a few hours away and..... this is what this forum has come to.....

I think even the Boss Springsteen had it on his mind from time to time......

[DracoM]

Men should be thankful to have suit and ties to fall back on when they need to be in a work situation where their personalities and characters don’t come into. What to wear at/for work is the biggest headache for women, especially for freelancers. You can talk about equality etc. until cows come home, but women are judged, often initially, by what they are wearing. It’s not always a serious issue but it is something that most working women dare not or cannot afford to ignore.

Totally agree - women have a far and unenviably bigger prob, but I still want more 'public men' to wear ties!

[gurnemanz]

In the 60's my sister, an excellent seamstress, usedto make herself flowery miniskirts and would sometimes knock up a tie for me with leftover material. They were unique and eye-catching. Still got - and occasionally wear - a couple of them. She offered to make me one for my recent 70th birthday for old times' sake, but it never appeared. I might remind her.

[gradus]

Still see ties made by local craftspeople at the Suffolk Craft Fair.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

It’s just a shift in convention.

Maybe, but it wreaks of laziness. It's traditional smart dressing with a "can't really be arsed" attitude.
I'm in a choir where the rehearsal before the concert is disrupted by a long debate about what the women should wear. Will they wear turquoise scarfs or maroon ones? Once they've decided, the next comment is: "Oh, the men can wear black" (or sometimes white) "open-necked shirts", at which point the men protest and insist on wearing bow ties to match the women's scarfs.

[doversoul1]

Totally agree - women have a far and unenviably bigger prob, but I still want more 'public men' to wear ties!

I find ‘public men’ making or think they are making a statement by what they wear/don’t wear more than a little suspicious. I feel like telling them ‘just get on with your job’.

[Boilk]

It's probably a generational thing.

I think a suit without a tie looks incomplete; casual jacket? fine. I bought many ties in the 1960s, when ties were attractive; but this has not been the case now for at least 3 decades: the shiny ones look lousy, status symbols.

For me ties didn't get interesting until the 1970s, when colourful, more daring geometric designs flourished. 1950s to mid-60s ties had those slim, ultra-boring, two-tone diagonal stripes on them - wouldn't be seen dead in something like that. My collection of 75-odd ties is in hibernation, since everywhere I've worked since about 2010 has a dress code of smart casual.

[doversoul1]

Once I worked with a man in his mid-50s and well established in the company. He sounded quite cultured but then one day he turned up with a Disney Winnie-the-Pooh tie. I lost all my respect for him.

[cloughie]

Maybe, but it wreaks of laziness. It's traditional smart dressing with a "can't really be arsed" attitude.
I'm in a choir where the rehearsal before the concert is disrupted by a long debate about what the women should wear. Will they wear turquoise scarfs or maroon ones? Once they've decided, the next comment is: "Oh, the men can wear black" (or sometimes white) "open-necked shirts", at which point the men protest and insist on wearing bow ties to match the women's scarfs.

Quite right too!

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Once I worked with a man in his mid-50s and well established in the company. He sounded quite cultured but then one day he turned up with a Disney Winnie-the-Pooh tie. I lost all my respect for him.

I had a large collection of such ties when I was teaching.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I find ‘public men’ making or think they are making a statement by what they wear/don’t wear more than a little suspicious. I feel like telling them ‘just get on with your job’.

Well Nigel Kennedy makes a statement by wearing something that looks like a bin liner with cycle clips. The statement does appear to be: “I’m a complete idiot”.

[jayne lee wilson]

Should you wish to deepen your knowledge of the significance of shirts/jackets/ties, especially in the understanding of masculinity and power as traditionally conceived, look at the sons of Don Corleone in the Godfather films... Michael, Sonny and Fredo, whose positions in the family and the expression of their own personas are vividly projected by how they wear that combination, with or without the tie: the positioning of the shirt collar against the suit collar for example....(flattened or raised, high or low etc)

(Just hit Google Images for more...)

Personally I like the rakishness of open-necked shirts worn with suit jackets (variously self-aware, self-assertive, self-projecting), but it is more stylish if the shirt collar is raised, rather than flattened against that of the collar (too neat, too weak, too conformist as per summer wear)...

The tieless shirt/jacket look can work very well for women too - the "maleness" of the shirt/jacket combo offsetting the femininity of hair/face, or the emphasis of a stronger, trousered, less made -up, shorthaired appearance...
As Doversoul said, Women are usually subjected to far greater sartorial oppressions (though allowed greater freedoms too), but this is a possible way out of it if you have the freedom or the boldness to take it on...(which comment should never be necessary in 2019....)

The "Charlie" ads were a pioneer in many respects, accessing the whole gamut of possibilities....

https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&biw=1440&bih=789&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=xNgxXYHmGr6GjLsPodyHmA8&q=Charlie+perfume+ads&oq=Charlie+perfume+ads&gs_l=img.3..0.55286.58602..58828...0.0..0.60.683.13......0....1..gws-wiz-img.......0i7i30j0i10i24j0i24.SxjA5ws4gg4&ved=0ahUKEwiB2O3OncHjAhU-A2MBHSHuAfMQ4dUDCAY&uact=5#imgrc=_

[Dave2002]

Maybe, but it wreaks of laziness.

So what’s wrong with laziness? “Lazy” is too often used as a pejorative term. It depends on the context. Some very “busy” people spend large parts of their lives doing things which are either completely pointless, or which don’t need to be done so frenetically.