Grumble Thread

[cloughie]

Yeah but no but yeah but

I and millions more have no trouble hearing that very distinction. I'd love to hear footie results read in a rich, warm Geordie. My favourite lilt of all despite the 3 or 4 varieties of Scouse, the estuary Northerners or the flattened out Lancastrians, I hear most of the time.

Its all as Hindemith once said in a different context, "Human Music"...

Yes Jayne I’m also a Northerner despite anton’s periodic jibes, but the same guy with the football results also does continuity on BBC won - I often think OK but who lost? I agree with you about the Geordie or even Makem accent, but Charlotte Green is my results reader of choice!

[french frank]

Yeah but no but yeah but

I and millions more have no trouble hearing that very distinction. I'd love to hear footie results read in a rich, warm Geordie. My favourite lilt of all despite the 3 or 4 varieties of Scouse, the estuary Northerners or the flattened out Lancastrians, I hear most of the time.

But you live in the north. Ideally and generally speaking (I don't know this Chris Mason) perhaps public broadcasters - not guests or 'casuals' - should cultivate an accent, regional or not, that no one has any difficulty understanding wherever they live.

Your own opinion comes narrowly filtered through your own aural familiarities. You don't include any southern accents among your favourites.

[jayne lee wilson]

But you live in the north. Ideally and generally speaking (I don't know this Chris Mason) perhaps public broadcasters - not guests or 'casuals' - should cultivate an accent, regional or not, that no one has any difficulty understanding wherever they live.

Your own opinion comes narrowly filtered through your own aural familiarities. You don't include any southern accents among your favourites.

But what is a "Southern Accent"? There are so many, from SW to Cockney to Norfolk and many shades of those... I was in Norwich for some years but never had a problem with them....

I guess you don't follow football much, but which score-reading accent would you prefer?
(Not that there's any need anymore for fans to have them read out...)

My own "accent" or rather lack of it, gets variously enquired of by taxi drivers (a fairly cosmopolitan lot themselves here) as - Australian?, American?, or even.... Public School?

So I'm all over the place as usual....

[cloughie]

But what is a "Southern Accent"? There are so many, from SW to Cockney to Norfolk and many shades of those... I was in Norwich for some years but never had a problem with them....

I guess you don't follow football much, but which score-reading accent would you prefer?
(Not that there's any need anymore for fans to have them read out...)

My own "accent" or rather lack of it, gets variously enquired of by taxi drivers (a fairly cosmopolitan lot themselves here) as - Australian?, American?, or even.... Public School?

So I'm all over the place as usual....

That description to me sounds like ‘posh scouse’. You can’t take the Liverpool out...

[jayne lee wilson]

That description to me sounds like ‘posh scouse’. You can’t take the Liverpool out...

Nice summary! But in fact I don't have a trace of true Scouse, even if my varying vowels are usually Northern & I tend to slur-a-lot.......
(yeah, gonna dontcha etc)
BTW - I was born in....Aberystwyth.....Welsh bio-Mother, Italian bio-father (well, probably - never met them).

Anyway - its dry outside! Time for Italian Coffee, French Croissants, and a pair of Austrian Binocs....

[cloughie]

Nice summary! But in fact I don't have a trace of true Scouse, even if my varying vowels are usually Northern & I tend to slur-a-lot.......
(yeahs, gonna dontcha etc)
BTW - I was born in....Aberystwyth.....Welsh bio-Mother, Italian bio-father (well, probably - never met them).

Anyway - its dry outside! Time for Italian Coffee, French Croissants, and a pair of Austrian Binocs....

Should be welsh cakes with your coffee with your background - how long have you been in the ‘Pool?

[Bryn]

Should be welsh cakes with your coffee with your background - how long have you been in the ‘Pool?

Never mind welsh cakes, what about the gelato the Italians in Wales are famous for?

[AmpH]

a pair of Austrian Binocs....

Swarovski I presume ?

[jayne lee wilson]

Should be welsh cakes with your coffee with your background - how long have you been in the ‘Pool?

I was adopted by parents from Birkenhead/Tranmere at about 3 months, brought up in Moreton/Meols (Wirral) till 11, then North Merseyside, never left till my mid-20s for various opportunities in Norwich then Europe....
(became devoted to Liverpool FC, especially through the European games reported in the Post&Echo, early on. Later when in Europe, Mum would always send me the latest cuttings.... Italians befriended me, just because of where I came from...they loved showing off the Gazetta dello Sport.
I literally dined out on that...

Always felt an outsider everywhere (like Mahler, thrice homeless). When Theresa May said "citizens of nowhere" I thought - yes and proud to be! But I guess I feel European, really...
One journalist, forget which, suggested that Liverpool was more like a South American city than an English one.... very striking insight, and for me true to the somewhat melodramatic, pop culture obsessed, football obsessed, emotional people here...(wherever they came from initially )

***
Yes Amp, the Swarovski 10x25s.... a rare every-few-decades treat, when my ageing Leica 8x42s were getting a bit heavy on the neck for the evening constitutional (well, the afternoon one now - better get going before its too dark!)

[french frank]

But what is a "Southern Accent"? There are so many,

Like northern accents? I was merely pointing out that in listing your 'favourites' they were all northern ones, like a) the one that was the subject of the discussion and b) where you now live. As I stressed, it isn't a matter of whether a broadcaster speaks with a regional accent or a southern RP accent, it's whether they are comprehensible to anyone listening, whether they live in the north or the south. The last R3 controller had a light Mancunian accent, the present one a NE, Stockton-on-Tees, accent. Noticeable (just) to a southerner, but never remotely difficult to understand. On the other hand, when I was doing an NVQ in carpentry and joinery with a class of young block release Bristolians, constantly asking them to repeat what they had said became positively embarrassing.

You are right: football has never interested me. Our family had a 2-generation tradition of playing serious club rugby and I was taken to Twickenham for international matches. I don't even claim to support any football team.

[Serial_Apologist]

Like northern accents? I was merely pointing out that in listing your 'favourites' they were all northern ones, like a) the one that was the subject of the discussion and b) where you now live. As I stressed, it isn't a matter of whether a broadcaster speaks with a regional accent or a southern RP accent, it's whether they are comprehensible to anyone listening, whether they live in the north or the south. The last R3 controller had a light Mancunian accent, the present one a NE, Stockton-on-Tees, accent. Noticeable (just) to a southerner, but never remotely difficult to understand. On the other hand, when I was doing an NVQ in carpentry and joinery with a class of young block release Bristolians, constantly asking them to repeat what they had said became positively embarrassing.

You are right: football has never interested me. Our family had a 2-generation tradition of playing serious club rugby and I was taken to Twickenham for international matches. I don't even claim to support any football team.

I had you down as being Bristol-born and bred, frenchie - where did I get that from??

I'm pretty good with accents, I'm told. Oddly enough the two I can't get my chops around are Scouse, and London Caribbean... conversance with the latter which is becoming de rigueur, ("nar mean?"), as it ever more rapidly shovels cockney in its various forms out into the suburbs and beyond. I was once pressed by a black lady I was dating to "do" a Jamaican accent, and made a poor, actually laughable stab at it, feeling very uncomfortable about any racist implications in my feeble mimicry.

[Vox Humana]

I know I'll be shot down as a snob, but I do miss the old, 'cut glass' BBC voices:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVaJ19-UT9g

[Serial_Apologist]

I know I'll be shot down as a snob, but I do miss the old, 'cut glass' BBC voices:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVaJ19-UT9g

"How grateful we were to the BBC when, every night, at 9 o'clock, Alvar Liddell brought us news of fresh disasters".

Jonathan Miller: "The Aftermyth of War" from "Beyond the Fringe", 1961.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Accents have always interested me. I like to guess the home locations of people I meet. Being Lancashire-born, I can work out locations in that region with an accuracy that would have impressed Professor Higgins.

On the radio I think it’s important that the speakers are understood. It’s interesting that National BBC programmes employ people with extreme regional accents that sometimes beg for subtitles (e.g. Steph McGovern) yet regional news programmes employ local people who could easily be understood nationwide. Perhaps national BBC has an agenda of its own, whilst the regional networks have more common sense.

[french frank]

I had you down as being Bristol-born and bred, frenchie - where did I get that from??

Yes, but north of the river, old chap, and travelled a bit, doncha know You may be better acquainted with Bem - or even El Dub . Different languages.