Free Move Create

[MrGongGong]

Those people who are actually interested in facilitating MUSIC rather than playing fantasy politics might like to look at this

https://freemovecreate.org/about

(Is it possible to simply leave this here to stop the usual "fol de rol" nonsense ? So no comments ? if not please delete it all)

[Lat-Literal]

Those people who are actually interested in facilitating MUSIC rather than playing fantasy politics might like to look at this

https://freemovecreate.org/about

(Is it possible to simply leave this here to stop the usual "fol de rol" nonsense ? So no comments ? if not please delete it all)

While the website says that members of this campaign come from a-n The Artists Information Company, the detailed description of a-n on the first page could heavily imply that a-n as an entity is behind this campaign.

That, though, is unlikely to be true as a-n is currently being supported financially by Arts Council England which is a non-departmental public body of the Government's own Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport.

[MrGongGong]

While the website says that members of this campaign come from a-n The Artists Information Company, the detailed description of a-n on the first page could heavily imply that a-n as an entity is behind this campaign.

That, though, is unlikely to be true as a-n is currently being supported financially by Arts Council England which is a non-departmental public body of the Government's own Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport.

Many of us are also supported financially by ACE (and Creative Scotland etc ) which doesn't mean we can't make statements about things which will adversely affect our work.
The "arms-length" principle has been much eroded but still exists.

There are several other organisations in support (ABO, RPS etc ) who also are funded in part by ACE.
Getting money from an arts council doesn't mean you have to only say what the government of the day wants (unless of course, you are in a country like Hungary but that's another issue all together).

[Lat-Literal]

Many of us are also supported financially by ACE (and Creative Scotland etc ) which doesn't mean we can't make statements about things which will adversely affect our work.
The "arms-length" principle has been much eroded but still exists.

There are several other organisations in support (ABO, RPS etc ) who also are funded in part by ACE.
Getting money from an arts council doesn't mean you have to only say what the government of the day wants (unless of course, you are in a country like Hungary but that's another issue all together).

But the website doesn't say that a-n as an organisation supports the campaign. It says "members" support it but then it provides a very detailed description of a-n as if to suggest the organisation also supports it. Are you saying that the organisation does support it or just members of that organisation? It sounds like the first - but it isn't clear to me from the site.

[MrGongGong]

But the website doesn't say that a-n as an organisation supports the campaign. It says "members" support it but then it provides a very detailed description of a-n as if it suggest the organisation does support it? Are you saying that the organisation does support it or just members of that organisation? It isn't clear to me.

I don't know
Why not ask them?
Given the way in which many people are constrained from expressing themselves these days I suspect they are covering themselves
but what does it matter anyway ?
The REAL issue is plain to see

[Lat-Literal]

I don't know
Why not ask them?
Given the way in which many people are constrained from expressing themselves these days I suspect they are covering themselves
but what does it matter anyway ?
The REAL issue is plain to see

I don't think anyone is suggesting that expression on the site should be constrained but rather in my case that it could be taken forward into clarity.

Concerns about future funding, though, could be an "in house" constraint.

As for the issue, I cannot and will not assess it until I have a full recall of how things were in the 1960s.

Which I won't ever have as I like to think that I wasn't really there.

Which I wasn't in some ways.

(Although I have read that while there was vote rigging at the RAH in 1968 in the Eurovision Song Contest there were no difficulties with access or performance rights per se. Portugal, Holland, Belgium, Luxemburg, Monaco, Austria, Switzerland, Sweden, Finland, France, Italy, Norway, Ireland, Spain, Germany and communist Yugoslavia - all pop joyously were here)

[Richard Barrett]

I think it's good that the ISM is involved in something like this, although at the same time it seems a bit pointless when nobody has any idea of how the situation is going to end up. I've heard stories from people who say (truthfully no doubt) that their work is already being affected by the present uncertainty, but once the uncertainty is ended things may look very different. Or they may not, but I don't think there's much mileage in protesting against possible scenarios which remain nebulous. Nor do I think musicians and artists should be given special treatment when it comes to travelling and working abroad, being a believer in free movement in general.

[MrGongGong]

I think it's good that the ISM is involved in something like this, although at the same time it seems a bit pointless when nobody has any idea of how the situation is going to end up. I've heard stories from people who say (truthfully no doubt) that their work is already being affected by the present uncertainty, but once the uncertainty is ended things may look very different. Or they may not, but I don't think there's much mileage in protesting against possible scenarios which remain nebulous. Nor do I think musicians and artists should be given special treatment when it comes to travelling and working abroad, being a believer in free movement in general.

I think (and I am someone who's work is already adversely affected by this) that many people are largely completely ignorant of how these things affect culture, education and other collaborative enterprises. Therefore, I DO think it's important to raise the issue.

[Lat-Literal]

I think (and I am someone who's work is already adversely affected by this) that many people are largely completely ignorant of how these things affect culture, education and other collaborative enterprises. Therefore, I DO think it's important to raise the issue.

I am sympathetic but I wish someone would explain it to me clearly.

Why some African artists can't get into Womad at Wiltshire for a day.

Genuinely, I don't understand it and until I do I can't have an informed view on visas etc for musicians in the round.

[Richard Barrett]

I don't understand it and until I do I can't have an informed view on visas etc for musicians in the round.

It's deliberately made impossible to have an informed view of things like that. Last year, as I mentioned at the time, I was planning a concert tour of the UK with an ensemble three of whose members were Serbian nationals. They all applied for the same visa giving exactly the same information; two were accepted and one denied, no reason given, no right to appeal. (Note: the UK is the only EU country which demands visas of Serbian nationals, and Serbia doesn't demand them of UK nationals.) For what it's worth, once the dust settles I believe that it's going to be a lot less difficult for UK artists in the EU than many people think, and possibly hardly if at all different from the situation as it is now.

[Lat-Literal]

It's deliberately made impossible to have an informed view of things like that. Last year, as I mentioned at the time, I was planning a concert tour of the UK with an ensemble three of whose members were Serbian nationals. They all applied for the same visa giving exactly the same information; two were accepted and one denied, no reason given, no right to appeal. (Note: the UK is the only EU country which demands visas of Serbian nationals, and Serbia doesn't demand them of UK nationals.) For what it's worth, once the dust settles I believe that it's going to be a lot less difficult for UK artists in the EU than many people think, and possibly hardly if at all different from the situation as it is now.

Thank you. You explain the frustrations of performers which is helpful. The same is true of audiences who have bought tickets with expectations. It is the last minute announcements at Womad that stay in my mind - few fortunately - but disappointing nonetheless, especially when a statement is made a quarter of an hour ahead of the anticipated gig. African in the main. But even with the Black Arm Band there was confusion a decade ago. Ruby Hunter was ill but others seemed to be missing with a hint of these issues. Aboriginal Australians all.

[MrGongGong]

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/nodeal-brexit-threatens-global-success-story-of-uks-top-orchestras-report-says-a4038511.html?fbclid=IwAR2cw3kreLxdMwJXgSsrkvb_AaYKObpPEYZuzM9aiYfDDOZzgNjy0EgNxbM

http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/08/13/orchestral-manoeuvres-in-the-dark-what-brexit-means-for-touring-musicians/

[Lat-Literal]

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/n...OZzgNjy0EgNxbM

http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/0...ing-musicians/

(1) Two Decades of the LSO

1960
LSO International Series is initiated

1961
Pierre Monteux becomes Principal Conductor

1963
First British orchestra to visit Japan
Board of Trustees set up to receive and administer funds for well-being and financial stability

1964
First World Tour: to Israel, Turkey, Iran, India, Hong Kong, Korea, Japan and the US, and a concert at the UN

1965
István Kertész becomes Principal Conductor

1966
First season as resident orchestra at the Florida International Festival.
Leonard Bernstein conducts the LSO for the first time
Second World Tour including the Far East and Australia

1967
The LSO visits Florida again

1968
Andre Previn becomes Principal Conductor

1971
Tour to Soviet Union and the Far East

1973
The LSO is the first British orchestra to be invited to perform at the Salzburg Festival

1974
First UK orchestra to appear at the Hollywood Bowl

1976
First Shell-LSO Music Scholarship and National Tour

1977
Khachaturian conducts the LSO

1979
Claudio Abbado becomes Principal Conductor
LSO shares in three Grammy awards for the score to Star Wars
Classic Rock recordings become hugely popular
Tour of the Soviet Union

[MrGongGong]

and ?

[Lat-Literal]

and ?

And:

(2) First Mention of a Place in an EEC/EU Country in the Official LSO Timeline

2006 - A new residency at Salle Pleyel in Paris is announced, some 33 years after 1973, beginning with Bernard Haitink conducting Beethoven.

You messaged me a while ago to advise against commenting on Brexit. However, you did not clarify in that e-mail your selective view on freedom of expression. You continue to raise it via threads and others continue to squirt theirs around other threads. All of it opinion. None of it substantiated by facts. So I am providing the facts of historical context. One of our orchestras went across most of the globe in the 1960s on old planes with all the ambition of that decade and no hand wringing over difficulties that hadn't actually been experienced.