Contacting government departments

[Dave2002]

I just looked up the word "omnishambles" - see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnishambles

This seems to apply to government departments, and trying to contact any sentient being able to help with issues would seem to have a very low probability of success. Phone contacts refer one back to the internet, but that doesn't work - after plugging in a few numbers to get into a queue for attention one is then told that "there is a high volume of calls" ... but persistence gets one into another queue, after which the phone line simply cuts off.

We know that HMG has many things to consider, and worry about, some associated with the B* word, but really the overall standard of customer facing service is very poor. However a few weeks ago I did get to talk to someone, and we had a perfectly rational conversation about actions which would be taken etc., and indeed some have materialised. What doesn't work though is trying to make to contact again to get a status update.

For the curious I was trying to check details of my State Pension entitlement. I suspect that other departments are similarly efficient (!) which is I'm afraid one reason why I try to keep clear of most of them for as long as possible.

Ah well, I'm not quite at the stage of quoting the well known line from Network.

[DracoM]

Aha! A Peter Finch fan.

[french frank]

To be fair (why?) it's not just HMG that keeps you waiting as they have a high volume of enquiries to deal with and did you know you can find out a great deal from their website.

I think I have something called a, well I don't know what it's called, a Gateway account?, which I thought linked up seamlessly and easily with all the government departments which might be able to help me with my enquiry, whatever it was. But I've forgotten the account details so I'm not sure what it's for.

Hope this helps.

[ahinton]

I just looked up the word "omnishambles" - see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnishambles

This seems to apply to government departments, and trying to contact any sentient being able to help with issues would seem to have a very low probability of success. Phone contacts refer one back to the internet, but that doesn't work - after plugging in a few numbers to get into a queue for attention one is then told that "there is a high volume of calls" ... but persistence gets one into another queue, after which the phone line simply cuts off.

We know that HMG has many things to consider, and worry about, some associated with the B* word, but really the overall standard of customer facing service is very poor. However a few weeks ago I did get to talk to someone, and we had a perfectly rational conversation about actions which would be taken etc., and indeed some have materialised. What doesn't work though is trying to make to contact again to get a status update.

For the curious I was trying to check details of my State Pension entitlement. I suspect that other departments are similarly efficient (!) which is I'm afraid one reason why I try to keep clear of most of them for as long as possible.

Ah well, I'm not quite at the stage of quoting the well known line from Network.

I have on occasion managed to get through to DWP and HMRC but I agree that it is often distressingly difficult.

If you ask DWP about "State Pension Entitlement" they'll probably wonder what you're referring to and refer you to whoever deals with its historical archives...

[Serial_Apologist]

As french frank says, not just government departments. A few days ago British Gas emailed me with "advice" on what to do in case of a boiler fault; boy, you should see the messages in the comments below, often in ripe language, unreproducible here!

[Dave2002]

Aha! A Peter Finch fan.

Currently on at the NT, and also the phrase is currently in one of the adverts for a power company on TV "I want you to go to the window ..... "

[Dave2002]

To be fair (why?) it's not just HMG that keeps you waiting as they have a high volume of enquiries to deal with and did you know you can find out a great deal from their website.

I think I have something called a, well I don't know what it's called, a Gateway account?, which I thought linked up seamlessly and easily with all the government departments which might be able to help me with my enquiry, whatever it was. But I've forgotten the account details so I'm not sure what it's for.

Hope this helps.

Sorry - I think that's a cop out. The services are under funded, and not run properly. I know that they have lots of enquiries, but that's no reason to run these agencies so badly. Actually perhaps I shouldn't have written "government departments" as nowadays a lot of the interaction is with "agencies" or "services", which I suppose are not strictly government departments - though I think most people will understand what I meant.

[MrGongGong]

I have on occasion managed to get through to DWP and HMRC but I agree that it is often distressingly difficult.

If you ask DWP about "State Pension Entitlement" they'll probably wonder what you're referring to and refer you to whoever deals with its historical archives...

If you ask the DWP about most things they will lie and make stuff up
Don't trust a word they say even when they appear to be nice and understanding
and keep detailed records in case you end up in court (and they probably won't even bother to turn up)

[Lat-Literal]

I just looked up the word "omnishambles" - see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnishambles

This seems to apply to government departments, and trying to contact any sentient being able to help with issues would seem to have a very low probability of success. Phone contacts refer one back to the internet, but that doesn't work - after plugging in a few numbers to get into a queue for attention one is then told that "there is a high volume of calls" ... but persistence gets one into another queue, after which the phone line simply cuts off.

We know that HMG has many things to consider, and worry about, some associated with the B* word, but really the overall standard of customer facing service is very poor. However a few weeks ago I did get to talk to someone, and we had a perfectly rational conversation about actions which would be taken etc., and indeed some have materialised. What doesn't work though is trying to make to contact again to get a status update.

For the curious I was trying to check details of my State Pension entitlement. I suspect that other departments are similarly efficient (!) which is I'm afraid one reason why I try to keep clear of most of them for as long as possible.

Ah well, I'm not quite at the stage of quoting the well known line from Network.

Don't get me started.

DWP is my least favourite department, not that I ever had the bad fortune to work there. My opinion is that changes there at senior level earlier this year might well in time be expected to create a more sympathetic climate. It wouldn't be the opinion of everyone and I'm not going into detail. Any brick walls have been acquired from the private sector. I have found local authorities to be among the worst but rounds of staff cuts at HMG haven't helped much. Many of the junior posts have been cut or are now filled by the transient so that no one of that kind is able to build up a significant work pension. There is also a greater emphasis now on delivering to the Government than answering questions from the public. I am not sure about the gateway account. There may indeed be a facility for communicating on it but I associate it more with people making tax returns. Spend three hours filling in the form. Get told three months later that they owe you five pence. Anyhow, if all else fails, write. Perhaps contrary to gut instinct, a direct letter to a Minister or a Department will be less effective than one to your MP asking him or her to forward your questions with a request for a reply. There is a time limit for responses to such correspondence which any department is expected to meet.

[Andrew353w]

Government departments are all encouraged to promote "digital by default" as the way of "communicating". I know-I work for one! This works quite well with computer literate people, but many people don't have/can't use the technology and therefore effectively become second class citizens, which is unfair, since they've paid their taxes as much as anyone!

When this method of operation was being phased in where I work (I won't say where, or which Government department it is) one of the guys explaining things gave us a beautiful analogy, which I will share with you all here: he suggested we viewed this new way of working in the same way as drivers in the 1970s & 80s viewed the introduction of self-service petrol pumps; when it started it was a battle to get anyone to use them, but if you wanted fuel, increasingly you had no choice. Nowadays no-one would expect to return to "attended service" petrol pumps. So it will be with the new ways of working.

[Lat-Literal]

Government departments are all encouraged to promote "digital by default" as the way of "communicating". I know-I work for one! This works quite well with computer literate people, but many people don't have/can't use the technology and therefore effectively become second class citizens, which is unfair, since they've paid their taxes as much as anyone!

When this method of operation was being phased in where I work (I won't say where, or which Government department it is) one of the guys explaining things gave us a beautiful analogy, which I will share with you all here: he suggested we viewed this new way of working in the same way as drivers in the 1970s & 80s viewed the introduction of self-service petrol pumps; when it started it was a battle to get anyone to use them, but if you wanted fuel, increasingly you had no choice. Nowadays no-one would expect to return to "attended service" petrol pumps. So it will be with the new ways of working.

Yes, quite, but a half decent MP will still enable the old methods.

Mine is a young one who was first elected in 2015 but he has got me results of a kind from a couple of departments in the last 12 months.

It is probably worth mentioning here to anyone who doesn't know that your own political preferences and the MP's party affiliation can be more or less irrelevant in these matters.

What helps most is whether they can be bothered.

[gradus]

If you ask the DWP about most things they will lie and make stuff up
Don't trust a word they say even when they appear to be nice and understanding
and keep detailed records in case you end up in court (and they probably won't even bother to turn up)

Perhaps I'm lucky but my experience (on behalf of others) differs from yours.
I deal with the DWP and other government agencies during most weeks on a range of issues and am often kept waiting for half an hour or more usually to the accompaniment of Vivaldi. The people that I eventually reach are generally helpful. There are occasional lapses and occasional highpoints in service. I can't recall any occasion when I have found that they have lied or made stuff up but I haven't been in court with them.

[Dave2002]

msg 10.

Oddly, since you mention attended petrol pumps, I believe I experienced these on two occasions in 2017. Didn't get my hands dirty!

[Dave2002]

Perhaps I'm lucky but my experience (on behalf of others) differs from yours.
I deal with the DWP and other government agencies during most weeks on a range of issues and am often kept waiting for half an hour or more**1 usually to the accompaniment of Vivaldi**2. The people that I eventually reach are generally helpful. There are occasional lapses and occasional highpoints in service. I can't recall any occasion when I have found that they have lied or made stuff up but I haven't been in court with them.

**1 I rest my case.

**2 Does that constitute cruel and unusual punishment? Probably not unusual, sadly!

[MrGongGong]

Perhaps I'm lucky but my experience (on behalf of others) differs from yours.
I deal with the DWP and other government agencies during most weeks on a range of issues and am often kept waiting for half an hour or more usually to the accompaniment of Vivaldi. The people that I eventually reach are generally helpful. There are occasional lapses and occasional highpoints in service. I can't recall any occasion when I have found that they have lied or made stuff up but I haven't been in court with them.

I have been to court against them recently
and won
As many others will testify they are fundamentally dishonest and duplicitous
inspired by Kafka

Read and weep

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201719/cmselect/cmworpen/355/355.pdf