A Classic FM presenter writes .....

[french frank]

Incidentally, the BBC mantra is: "Audiences are at the heart of everything we do".

What it means: "The audience skews too far 65+, social grades ABC1 and male - must be corrected."

What it does not mean: "What do the listeners want?"

[LMcD]

Yes, I know - they are the professional broadcasters. Of course they know best.

Welcome aboard HMS 'Don't Ask Questions And We'll Get Along Fine'.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Incidentally, the BBC mantra is: "Audiences are at the heart of everything we do".

What it means: "The audience skews too far 65+, social grades ABC1 and male - must be corrected."

What it does not mean: "What do the listeners want?"

That’s just BBC PR - you wouldn’t believe how relatively infrequently the word audience crops up amongst programmes makers and commissioners.

[Serial_Apologist]

Yes, I know - they are the professional broadcasters. Of course they know best.

One gets an impression of what it must have been like living in the Soviet Union in the 1930s - 1970s.

[french frank]

That’s just BBC PR - you wouldn’t believe how relatively infrequently the word audience crops up amongst programmes makers and commissioners.

If that's so, how do you explain the various reports (unpublished but findable) which reveal 'improvements' in e.g. lowering the average age, gaining C2D listeners and reducing the male/female bias? I can believe producers may not talk about it much - who would they be talking about it to? But station strategy is precisely what this is all about.

The BBC's Marketing and Audiences department, certainly in Mark Thompson's time, was very powerful. They dictated to individual services which BBC trails they had to take, when they broadcast them and how frequently. R3 commissioning briefs describe the audience demographic for programmes and what the successful bidder is expected to achieve (eg keep as much of the Breakfast audience listening over the 9am junction and keep listeners listening for as long as possible).

I remember Paul Donovan's "Radio Waves" column in the S Times asking of Radio 3 "Where's the vision?". Radio 3 has had no vision for decades.

[Ian Old Bean]

If that's so, how do you explain the various reports (unpublished but findable) which reveal 'improvements' in e.g. lowering the average age, gaining C2D listeners and reducing the male/female bias? I can believe producers may not talk about it much - who would they be talking about it to? But station strategy is precisely what this is all about.

The BBC's Marketing and Audiences department, certainly in Mark Thompson's time, was very powerful. They dictated to individual services which BBC trails they had to take, when they broadcast them and how frequently. R3 commissioning briefs describe the audience demographic for programmes and what the successful bidder is expected to achieve (eg keep as much of the Breakfast audience listening over the 9am junction and keep listeners listening for as long as possible).

I remember Paul Donovan's "Radio Waves" column in the S Times asking of Radio 3 "Where's the vision?". Radio 3 has had no vision for decades.

I thought the whole point of channels such as Radio 3 and BBC 4 was to offer an alternative, rather than simply courting popularity. If we measure success solely based on the number of listeners then every radio station would broadcast pop music 24 hours a day and wouldn't that be dull.

[LMcD]

I thought the whole point of channels such as Radio 3 and BBC 4 was to offer an alternative, rather than simply courting popularity. If we measure success solely based on the number of listeners then every radio station would broadcast pop music 24 hours a day and wouldn't that be dull.

Classic FM has cheerfully admitted to being a pop music station that just happens to broadcast classical music.

[Serial_Apologist]

Classic FM has cheerfully admitted to being a pop music station that just happens to broadcast classical music.

As has repeatedly been pointed out it already exists and caters for that end of the market.

[Roger Webb]

I thought the whole point of channels such as Radio 3 and BBC 4 was to offer an alternative, rather than simply courting popularity. .

Well it may have been, but knowing what's happening to Radio 3 let's look at BBC4.

Tonight, which I think is generally thought of as 'Culture' night (the capital C is intentional....as are the quotation marks, sometimes used to indicate doubt or irony), has 7.30 Flat Pack Pop: Sweden's Music Miracle, followed at 8.00 by Hannah Waddingham's [who she?] Eurovision1974 Celebration, followed by, wait for it, 8.10 Eurovision Song Contest 1974. And then to round off an evening of this cultural feast, 10.00, Eurovision at 60.

The great sadness is that Georgia is on holiday, and, if previous vacations are anything to go by has jetted off to a beach or ski slope somewhere, and will miss this extravaganza of her favourite entertainment.

[french frank]

followed by, wait for it, 8.10 Eurovision Song Contest 1974. And then to round off an evening of this cultural feast, 10.00, Eurovision at 60.

The great sadness is that Georgia is on holiday, and, if previous vacations are anything to go by has jetted off to a beach or ski slope somewhere, and will miss this extravaganza of her favourite entertainment.

My great sadness is that BBC Four ('Everybody needs a place to think' - remember that?) doesn't seem to have those old Top of the Pops programmes now. But I mustn't be selfish: in Sept 2025 it will be my 30th anniversary of living in a house without a television set - my own 'place to think'.

[Roger Webb]

[QUOTE=french frank;n1303633]

My great sadness is that BBC Four doesn't seem to have those old Top of the Pops programmes now/QUOTE]

Hate to ruin your evening but BBC4 Friday 7.00pm TOTP 1995, 7.30, TOTP 1992, 8.00, TOTP 8.30....then it's Amy Winehouse all the way till 12.40 including an appearance with 'our very own' Jools Holland!!

See what you're missing?

[french frank]

Hate to ruin your evening but BBC4 Friday 7.00pm TOTP 1995, 7.30, TOTP 1992, 8.00, TOTP 8.30....then it's Amy Winehouse all the way till 12.40 including an appearance with 'our very own' Jools Holland!!

See what you're missing?

Good grief! The whole idea of a kiddies' pop show from the last century being on the BBC's cultural 'flagship' television channel was always so absurd, I thought .... but it's on non-stop, for days on end

[Ein Heldenleben]

Well it may have been, but knowing what's happening to Radio 3 let's look at BBC4.

Tonight, which I think is generally thought of as 'Culture' night (the capital C is intentional....as are the quotation marks, sometimes used to indicate doubt or irony), has 7.30 Flat Pack Pop: Sweden's Music Miracle, followed at 8.00 by Hannah Waddingham's [who she?] Eurovision1974 Celebration, followed by, wait for it, 8.10 Eurovision Song Contest 1974. And then to round off an evening of this cultural feast, 10.00, Eurovision at 60.

The great sadness is that Georgia is on holiday, and, if previous vacations are anything to go by has jetted off to a beach or ski slope somewhere, and will miss this extravaganza of her favourite entertainment.

Roger - why does no one admit it ? The Eurovision Song Contest is absolute cobblers and always has been . I’ve no problem with pop or rock music when it’s written by the Beatles or The Who but talents like that wouldn’t touch it with a barge pole. Intellectuals who affect a passion for it in a post- modern ironic way “it’s so camp it’s great “ should be made to memorise Shakespeare for a year. Trahaison des clercs doesn’t do justice to their pathetic condescending nod to the trivial. Watching this overblown farrago -that would fund an orchestra for a year- is a waste of your years on this planet.

[oddoneout]

Good grief! The whole idea of a kiddies' pop show from the last century being on the BBC's cultural 'flagship' television channel was always so absurd, I thought .... but it's on non-stop, for days on end

Not quite days on end - just the whole of Friday night. Which at least means I don't need to scan the listings that day...

[Roger Webb]

Roger - why does no one admit it ? The Eurovision Song Contest is absolute cobblers and always has been . .

I can't answer that question, but having been on the receiving end of a few sharp tongues when I've declined invitations to 'Eurovision parties'....yes, people have invited me to their houses to sit in front of theirTV, watch every 'act' and mark a specially printed scorecard on the merit of each composition, wait for the seemingly endless round of scoring by 'The Judges' from each country to conclude and then be complimented on my good taste and obvious inside knowledge of the music business (before running a CD shop I worked in music shops and recording studios as a lowly engineer)....I've learned to make a weak excuse rather than offend.

I made an exception with GM on EC when she reminded us constantly that she had managed to secure tickets for the Eurovision finals in Liverpool....with the result that she refused to read out my contributions to her programme - before that I'd usually been 'done' at least two or three times a week.

It seems that possession of tickets to Eurovision is something that the more astute Radio 3 listener is meant to regard as good fortune by this most overrated presenter!

Skellers back tomorrow, I'll try my luck with him on EC....can't imagine he'd have much truck with the Eurotrash thing!! But would he dare tell the 'intellectuals' so?!