Left handed players

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

"Foothill" to her friends.

A chip off the old block no doubt.

[Richard Barrett]

Cricket is rubbish too. (runs for cover )

As some will know, my other half is a harpist, and as it happens she is left-handed which is actually an advantage in harping since the sound of the instrument itself is weaker in the mid-to-low registers where the left hand is most often situated.

As some will also know, the (right-handed) baroque violinist Reinhard Goebel had to interrupt his playing activities in 1990 because of an injury to his left hand, during which time he relearned to play the instrument the other way around. (More recently he seems to have given up playing altogether and turned to teaching and conducting instead.)

[Hornspieler]

Originally Posted by Eine Alpensinfonie Most brass players use the right hand to operate the valves, but it's different with the French horn.

Further explanation of my previous post:

We are talking about the orchestral horn here.

The right hand has a most important function. Placed inside the bell, not only does it help to support the weight of the instrument, it is also used to control both the tone and the pitch of the notes, from hand stopping, giving a muted sound (gestopft) to open - the position of the hand and fingers to offer the sound most pleasing to the player.

The valves or pistons, operated by the fingers of the left hand, grip the instrument in position. but unlike the trumpet, use of the valves is much less of a requirement, as the horn register is higher up the harmonic series than is the case with a trumpet (or cornet)
In fact, there are only two notes in the compass of the instrument which require using the 3rd valve at all. So a 'leftie' might have the finger facility of a violinist, but does not actually need it.

In the case of the natural (valveless) horn, which has attracted quite a lot of interest recently on these boards, I would suggest that our fellow member Tony would appear to be more qualified to speak than I am; but since all the work is done by the hand which is inside the bell, it really doesn't matter which hand it is, because it is quite easy to hold the instrument to the other side of the body, but I doubt if many left handed people would bother.

A bit long winded but relevent, I think, to the original subject of this thread.

HS

[gradus]

HS many thanks for the explanations, I love the sound of the instrument but had no idea that mostly only 2 valves are used. So it isn't because of the complexity of valve operation that the horn is so notoriously difficult to play well?

[MrGongGong]

HS many thanks for the explanations, I love the sound of the instrument but had no idea that mostly only 2 valves are used. So it isn't because of the complexity of valve operation that the horn is so notoriously difficult to play well?

I think the main reason why the horn is considered difficult is that when you play it you are playing further up the harmonic series than on other brass instruments.
The main consequence of this is that the notes get effectively "closer" together so pitching becomes rather tricky in the upper register.... though there are those (Pip, Dennis, Arkady etc) who make the whole high note thing sound effortless.
Whether it's really true or not, it was always a good excuse for doing the classic splurge at the end of the New World Symphony

[ahinton]

Cricket is rubbish too. (runs for cover )

...but it takes so very much longer to be rubbish than does soccer...

[teamsaint]

...but it takes so very much longer to be rubbish than does soccer...

Not necessarily.
There is no fixed time limit for a cricket match, other than a maximum.

The ways in which the body operates in other areas of skill, like batting in cricket, where both hands are used for diferent operations,do seem to me to have a relevance to the OP.

Going back to stringed instruments, I wonder why they developed so that right handers, ( clearly the dominant group) use their left hand for fingering, when one might think that of the two operations, fingering and bowing, that fingering might be the more difficult skill to master, and the left hand less well adapted for the task.

[LeMartinPecheur]

Cricket is rubbish too. (runs for cover )

Pedant's Paradise perhaps, but one runs into the covers, or - all too commonly - to get the covers on sharpish

[P. G. Tipps]

Frankly, I'm astonished that one's natural handsuality should be such a topic of conversation on a forum such as this.

No one anymore hears much reference these days about 'left-footers' , and one's race and 'sexuality' are considered to be quite beyond the pale for any sort of reasonably intelligent discussion in polite quarters.So why pick on minority left-handers?

Let's have some proper forum even-handedness please!

[visualnickmos]

....So why pick on minority left-handers?

Let's have some proper forum even-handedness please!

I don't think anyone was or is, 'picking on' left-handers.... and no - sadly, I'm not even being offered a back-hander! more wine, s'il vous plait!

[LeMartinPecheur]

Frankly, I'm astonished that one's natural handsuality should be such a topic of conversation on a forum such as this.

No one anymore hears much reference these days about 'left-footers' , and one's race and 'sexuality' are considered to be quite beyond the pale for any sort of reasonably intelligent discussion in polite quarters.So why pick on minority left-handers?

Let's have some proper forum even-handedness please!

The point is surely to explore the practical effects of being a left-handed classical musician. There must be some, as illustrated by the cartoons and comments about left-handed string players. I think I asked here ages ago if any of the great pianists were left-handers (in the days before LH pianos existed). Unfortunately I can't recall the answers, if any

[slarty]

I am/was a left-handed fiddle player and when I began at age 8(1956), I was told that no one learned to play "the other way around", and getting employment within an orchestral structure was well nigh impossible if one did. I went on to play professionally for over 20 years, but my pizzicato was never as good as my colleagues as my right hand was, by comparison, very weak. I also, around the same time, began to learn golf, and was told to learn it right handed as, in those days, left-handed equipment was all nigh impossible to find for left-handed children. (it is not that much better today, as far as equipment is concerned, but that is another thread)

I also played Clarinet and Saxophone professionally, but these caused no problems to learn.
I batted and bowled left - tennis/table tennis left, hockey right, because there are no left-handed hockey sticks.
I write left handed, but that was almost a non-starter, because at my first primary school, i was beaten with a stick across the left hand because I had already learned to write before starting school, and were it not for my parents threatening legal action against the nun responsible, i would probably be writing right handed today.

My greatest difficulty was mastering the piano with such an over dominant left hand, I never did get very far with it.
In all my time playing violin, I only ever saw one "leftie" playing left, she was an Australian girl at, I think, the RCM in london(in the sixties). She was training for a soloist career.I don't remember her amounting to much.
It would of course be impossible to use "left handedness" as a reason for not accepting someone today, but the musical organizations would just pass over the player as being not right for the position.

As for conducting, an earlier poster stated that it was ridiculous for anyone to hold the baton in the left hand, well having conducted a great deal, I would like to say that the poster does not know what he is talking about. Try telling Runnicles to use the stick in his right hand! Paavo Berglund, one of the greatest Sibelians of all, also conducted with the left hand, I never had any problems following him, neither did any of my colleagues. As for me conducting, I never once had a complaint from any orchestral musician to say the he/she could not follow because I was using the baton in a different hand.
To finish, I will say that many left-handers of my generation began to play golf, as I did, using right handed clubs. Two players of this type managed decent careers for all the extra difficulties that manifested themselves because of it, Ben Hogan and Tom Watson!

[Beef Oven!]

I am/was a left-handed fiddle player and when I began at age 8(1956), I was told that no one learned to play "the other way around", and getting employment within an orchestral structure was well nigh impossible if one did. I went on to play professionally for over 20 years, but my pizzicato was never as good as my colleagues as my right hand was, by comparison, very weak. I also, around the same time, began to learn golf, and was told to learn it right handed as, in those days, left-handed equipment was all nigh impossible to find for left-handed children. (it is not that much better today, as far as equipment is concerned, but that is another thread)

I also played Clarinet and Saxophone professionally, but these caused no problems to learn.
I batted and bowled left - tennis/table tennis left, hockey right, because there are no left-handed hockey sticks.
I write left handed, but that was almost a non-starter, because at my first primary school, i was beaten with a stick across the left hand because I had already learned to write before starting school, and were it not for my parents threatening legal action against the nun responsible, i would probably be writing right handed today.

My greatest difficulty was mastering the piano with such an over dominant left hand, I never did get very far with it.
In all my time playing violin, I only ever saw one "leftie" playing left, she was an Australian girl at, I think, the RCM in london(in the sixties). She was training for a soloist career.I don't remember her amounting to much.
It would of course be impossible to use "left handedness" as a reason for not accepting someone today, but the musical organizations would just pass over the player as being not right for the position.

As for conducting, an earlier poster stated that it was ridiculous for anyone to hold the baton in the left hand, well having conducted a great deal, I would like to say that the poster does not know what he is talking about. Try telling Runnicles to use the stick in his right hand! Paavo Berglund, one of the greatest Sibelians of all, also conducted with the left hand, I never had any problems following him, neither did any of my colleagues. As for me conducting, I never once had a complaint from any orchestral musician to say the he/she could not follow because I was using the baton in a different hand.
To finish, I will say that many left-handers of my generation began to play golf, as I did, using right handed clubs. Two players of this type managed decent careers for all the extra difficulties that manifested themselves because of it, Ben Hogan and Tom Watson!

Such adversity that would not have to be endured, as you did, today. Fascinating reading (forgive the expression) and thank you for sharing it with us.

[slarty]

Thanks Beefy. to elaborate on conducting, it may not look like much, it may even look easy, but just watch professional actors trying to portray conductors, most of them have not got a clue, very few can do it convincingly.
the baton in one's hand is as important to a conductor as a writer and his pen/pencil, the sensitivity and dexterity required are such that no one would consider changing hands just to suit fashion.
Some great conductors looked very stylish with the baton, Beecham, Kempe and Barbirolli come to mind, others can seem very ungainly, even clumsy, Furtwängler and Thielemann are examples of this, but their music making is of the highest standard. It does not matter to professionals whether the conductor is a rightie or a leftie.
anyone who has ever injured or hurt their dominant hand will know just how physically difficult and mentally demanding it is to do even menial chores with the other hand.

[Beef Oven!]

Thanks Beefy. to elaborate on conducting, it may not look like much, it may even look easy, but just watch professional actors trying to portray conductors, most of them have not got a clue, very few can do it convincingly.
the baton in one's hand is as important to a conductor as a writer and his pen/pencil, the sensitivity and dexterity required are such that no one would consider changing hands just to suit fashion.
Some great conductors looked very stylish with the baton, Beecham, Kempe and Barbirolli come to mind, others can seem very ungainly, even clumsy, Furtwängler and Thielemann are examples of this, but their music making is of the highest standard. It does not matter to professionals whether the conductor is a rightie or a leftie.
anyone who has ever injured or hurt their dominant hand will know just how physically difficult and mentally demanding it is to do even menial chores with the other hand.

I've never thought that conducting looked easy, except when I was about 6 years old!

Your post has shattered my belief that when I am in the middle of my living room, standing on the pouffe waving a knitting around to the CD of HvK's BPO Bruckner 8, I am doing a convincing and possibly musical job!!!