Stormy Weather

[DracoM]

Like living on Hoy in a storm oop 'ere in Ultima Thule. Shovelling it down and winds like I've never seen even oop 'ere.

[EdgeleyRob]

Crazy weather in the Manchester area.
Trees,wheelie bins and a couple of chunks of the guttering from my house littering the roads.
Rumour has it the etihad stadium may have blown down,well it was still standing when I passed it on my way home from work,but we live in hope.
Just noticed Eveton v Palace is off too,due to safety reasons.
Worst of all my car cd player isn't working,now that's a crisis.

[MrGongGong]

Like living on Hoy in a storm oop 'ere in Ultima Thule. Shovelling it down and winds like I've never seen even oop 'ere.

Maybe you will get a nice swan terrine out of one that blows into your house ?

(yes, I know Max has moved but he used to live there )

[Petrushka]

Pet, forgive me if I speak severely , I speak as someone professionally involved with the issues of climate change and its effect on the coast for the last 10 years of my career, so had to immerse myself in the subject matter pretty fully. You can be an agnostic about the causes of climate change, whether it's part of a long term cycle, etc., if you like, but about climate change itself there is no room for doubt. It is happening. Sea and air temperatures are going up, glaciers and icecaps are melting, sea level is rising, something as simple as harbour gauges around our coast tell the story from the last 200 years.

I found the sentence helpfully decoded by David-G perfectly straightforward, if clumsily expressed - I read it as saying the modelling available to us is not sufficiently sophisticated to attribute fully the anthropogenic component in any given storm system. Not gobbledegook at all, but you do need to familiarise yourself with the subject matter.

Actually I find terms like "atheist" or "agnostic" unhelpful in this context as they imply that an element of belief is involved. It isn't - it's about the science. Arguing (as I've more or less given up trying to do) with saloon bar climate change sceptics is a waste of time because they are resistant to the evidence - for them it really is a question of belief.

Here are a couple of helpful websites - the Met Office one speaks for itself, the UKCIP one (nothing to do with UKIP ) is the UK Climate Impacts Programme at the University of Oxford which advises DEFRA etc. - you'll have heard it referred to several times on the news in the last few days.

http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/climatechange/science/monitoring/ukcp09/

http://www.ukcip.org.uk/

Many thanks for the info (and for not speaking too severely!). The problem with the issue of climate change is that it is shrouded in myth, bogus science, actual science, guesswork, lies, statistics and somewhere in amongst it all, maybe, a nugget of truth. One doesn't know what or who to believe and it all leads to a lot of weary cynicism. That something is happening is clear; the what and why still seem difficult to assess. I try to keep an open mind on issues but the 'experts' themselves have different opinions and, like the food debate, it's not easy to sift fact from fiction.

[Serial_Apologist]

Many thanks for the info (and for not speaking too severely!). The problem with the issue of climate change is that it is shrouded in myth, bogus science, actual science, guesswork, lies, statistics and somewhere in amongst it all, maybe, a nugget of truth. One doesn't know what or who to believe and it all leads to a lot of weary cynicism. That something is happening is clear; the what and why still seem difficult to assess. I try to keep an open mind on issues but the 'experts' themselves have different opinions and, like the food debate, it's not easy to sift fact from fiction.

On balance there's a broad consensus to go along with. Even it some new theory emerges to disprove it, a lot of good could still be done; after all, we are the most wasteful species on earth.

[jayne lee wilson]

Many thanks for the info (and for not speaking too severely!). The problem with the issue of climate change is that it is shrouded in myth, bogus science, actual science, guesswork, lies, statistics and somewhere in amongst it all, maybe, a nugget of truth. One doesn't know what or who to believe and it all leads to a lot of weary cynicism. That something is happening is clear; the what and why still seem difficult to assess. I try to keep an open mind on issues but the 'experts' themselves have different opinions and, like the food debate, it's not easy to sift fact from fiction.

Sorry to repeat myself a little Pet, but - exactly WHICH "myth, bogus science...guesswork, lies" do you refer to here? You HAVE to be specific, or else this is just fence-sitting, "oh, we'll never know", buck-passing to the next generation. (I'm sure they'll be very grateful...). Why isn't the current scientific consensus (which is all you're ever going to get) enough for you? Again, what evidence would satisfy you?
Evidently, I'm with Richard Tarleton all the way here - apart from the large changes I mentioned earlier, you do see it everywhere - in the flora/fauna of my own garden and beyond...

[teamsaint]

Sorry to repeat myself a little Pet, but - exactly WHICH "myth, bogus science...guesswork, lies" do you refer to here? You HAVE to be specific, or else this is just fence-sitting, "oh, we'll never know", buck-passing to the next generation. (I'm sure they'll be very grateful...). Why isn't the current scientific consensus (which is all you're ever going to get) enough for you? Again, what evidence would satisfy you?
Evidently, I'm with Richard Tarleton all the way here - apart from the large changes I mentioned earlier, you do see it everywhere - in the flora/fauna of my own garden and beyond...

yes, we do see those things. There is change. But the politicians (and I know we can't rely on them), really aren't talking about anything else other than carbon emissions (which are no doubt an important component), in terms of our impact on the environment.
Sustainability musty surely be about so much more, but it has been reduced to a single issue subject, and one where those with wealth can make more, via carbon trading and so on.
On energy. Here we are , well into the 21st century, with some quite unbelievably wonderful and powerful technology at our disposal, and we are looking at fracking (and its carbon emitting products) to solve our needs. This tells me what I need to know about the motivations of those in power.

[Flay]

I see an inquiry is to be opened. Floodgate?

[Richard Tarleton]

but - exactly WHICH "myth, bogus science...guesswork, lies" do you refer to here?

"Today" have just wheeled out - or should that be dug up - Lord Lawson (again), in the interest of "balance". They really should stop doing this.

[Flay]

"Today" have just wheeled out - or should that be dug up - Lord Lawson (again), in the interest of "balance". They really should stop doing this.

Have you noticed that when people are pushing potty policies and opinions like that they always appear to gabble, and talk in rapid phrases without allowing breaks, thus reducing the chance of being interrupted? He was spouting rubbish.

[BBMmk2]

Have you noticed that when people are pushing potty policies and opinions like that they always appear to gabble, and talk in rapid phrases without allowing breaks, thus reducing the chance of being interrupted? He was spouting rubbish.

Don't they always! Red Alert in my area yesterday. It was awful! Still going to be windy with showers, with maybe an appearance of that yellow round thing!?!?!?(shhh!!!:)

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I see an inquiry is to be opened. Floodgate?

[Richard Tarleton]

Just been out clearing the top of neighbour's 50 ft Norway Spruce from our garden - it smashed a hole in our beech hedge - I was actually looking out of the window when it happened, snapped like a matchstick.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

"Today" have just wheeled out - or should that be dug up - Lord Lawson (again), in the interest of "balance". They really should stop doing this.

Nigel Lawson was so ridiculous that he must have swayed many people the other way. Talk about wriggling politicians.

The weather on the Yorkshire coast hasn't been as bad as elsewhere, so imagine my surprise when I crashed into the branches of a fallen tree in my car last night. No harm done.

[Sir Velo]

Sorry to repeat myself a little Pet, but - exactly WHICH "myth, bogus science...guesswork, lies" do you refer to here? You HAVE to be specific, or else this is just fence-sitting, "oh, we'll never know", buck-passing to the next generation. (I'm sure they'll be very grateful...). Why isn't the current scientific consensus (which is all you're ever going to get) enough for you? Again, what evidence would satisfy you?
Evidently, I'm with Richard Tarleton all the way here - apart from the large changes I mentioned earlier, you do see it everywhere - in the flora/fauna of my own garden and beyond...

Agreed. Even if the evidence isn't conclusive it is certainly overwhelming. It's rather like the causal link between cigarette smoking and lung cancer; its hard to prove but you'd have to be an eejit not to conclude that the evidence stacks up on one side. What have we got to lose by cutting down on needless consumption? Think about all the flights taken to attend business conferences when there is videoconferencing. Over 50% of car journeys in the UK are under 2 miles. Give me strength!