Stormy Weather

[Anna]

It was 4C at 7am but it managed to climb to just under 19C, falling now, probably heading for frosts shortly. Seems to be downhill all the way now and so gloomy by about 7pm but at least no further rain forecast for about a week (we too had that violent downpour yesterday) I would say it's time to get Winter woollies out but they've never gone away. All in all, a pretty rotten year for me personally (due to family matters, death and now fave cousin diagnosed with prostate cancer) and I'll be glad to see the end of it, Roll on Christmas and 2013! I might even buy some Christmas Cards and a calendar to hasten the end of the year.

[salymap]

It was 4C at 7am but it managed to climb to just under 19C, falling now, probably heading for frosts shortly. Seems to be downhill all the way now and so gloomy by about 7pm but at least no further rain forecast for about a week (we too had that violent downpour yesterday) I would say it's time to get Winter woollies out but they've never gone away. All in all, a pretty rotten year for me personally (due to family matters, death and now fave cousin diagnosed with prostate cancer) and I'll be glad to see the end of it, Roll on Christmas and 2013! I might even buy some Christmas Cards and a calendar to hasten the end of the year.

Sorry about the family sadness Anna, Ilost a friend with prostate cancer, although it doesn't always end that way of course. He ignored doctors and spend pounds on a herbal extract or something. i want a nice autumn before Christmas comes, although I've already had four or five Appeals from charities I've supported in the past and the inevitable books of raffle tickets.

Yes I'm back to woollies too, parky today, as we Londoners used to say.

[Anna]

Thanks saly. Cousin is undergoing intensive 5 days a week chemo for 6 weeks, so crossed fingers (he is my great-aunt's youngest, so does that make him a 2nd cousin? Find degrees of kinship very complicated!!) I find I get appeals from charities I've never supported, still makes you feel guilty if you ignore them. I always buy charity Christmas cards, our library has a shop where all proceeds are guaranteed to go to the charity concerned (as opposed to High Street retailers who skim off the profit and donate about 2p) and it's good because they stock cards from lesser supported charities.

[salymap]

Thanks saly. Cousin is undergoing intensive 5 days a week chemo for 6 weeks, so crossed fingers (he is my great-aunt's youngest, so does that make him a 2nd cousin? Find degrees of kinship very complicated!!) I find I get appeals from charities I've never supported, still makes you feel guilty if you ignore them. I always buy charity Christmas cards, our library has a shop where all proceeds are guaranteed to go to the charity concerned (as opposed to High Street retailers who skim off the profit and donate about 2p) and it's good because they stock cards from lesser supported charities.

I support clicSargent because of the musical connection and the money all goes to helping families of and children with cancer.
And I call all my cousins just cousins, as some are grandchildren of my actual first cousins who have all died. bestio

[mangerton]

Thanks saly. Cousin is undergoing intensive 5 days a week chemo for 6 weeks, so crossed fingers (he is my great-aunt's youngest, so does that make him a 2nd cousin? Find degrees of kinship very complicated!!)

Sorry to hear about your cousin, Anna. Speaking with my family-tree researcher's hat on, he is your first cousin once removed. If he has any offspring, they are your second cousins.

[salymap]

Sorry to hear about your cousin, Anna. Speaking with my family-tree researcher's hat on, he is your first cousin once removed. If he has any offspring, they are your second cousins.

I didn't study it mangerton but isn't any offpring Anna's first cousin twice removed. If Anna had children they would be his 2nd cousins. It's a difficult subject and cousin does for me.

[mangerton]

I didn't study it mangerton but isn't any offpring Anna's first cousin twice removed. If Anna had children they would be his 2nd cousins. It's a difficult subject and cousin does for me.

saly, As you say, it is a difficult subject. I stand by what I said. If Anna had children they would be first cousins twice removed to Anna's first cousin once removed. Anna would be a second cousin to any children of her first cousin once removed.

There are a number of websites offering explanations. This is quite clear. Scroll down to the "cousin chart" and you'll see how it works. It all depends on the "common ancestor". It's also helpful to draw it on paper, and even more helpful to substitute the names of members of one's own family to explore relationships, which is what I did to check in this case.

But I agree, "cousin" is usually close enough for all practical purposes.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

If Anna had children they would be first cousins twice removed to Anna's first cousin once removed. Anna would be a second cousin to any children of her first cousin once removed.

Sounds like a line from a G&S opera!

[salymap]

Wow,it's a minefield mangerton. I was told Icouldn't be 2nd cousin as cousins had to be an equal distance from the common ancestor and I don't have children. So I have to be lst cousin, once, twic, etc removed.

To make matters worse my first cousin's daughter insists that her 1st cousin's children are her nephews and nieces I need a coffee

[eighthobstruction]

First day I thought I ought to be wearing gloves on dog walk....white finger syndrome....

[mangerton]

To make matters worse my first cousin's daughter insists that her 1st cousin's children are her nephews and nieces I need a coffee

Quite! I'm just having mine now. When I was very young (almost a book title!) children had to call adult friends of parents "aunt" or "uncle", and then of course there was Uncle Mac on the wireless. All very confusing for a child. I still get Christmas cards from a very aged lady who calls herself "Aunt Margaret". She is the widow of my late father's first cousin - so no relation at all.


PS to ferneyhoughgeliebte: Yes it does, doesn't it!

[salymap]

Quite! I'm just having mine now. When I was very young (almost a book title!) children had to call adult friends of parents "aunt" or "uncle", and then of course there was Uncle Mac on the wireless. All very confusing for a child. I still get Christmas cards from a very aged lady who calls herself "Aunt Margaret". She is the widow of my late father's first cousin - so no relation at all.


PS to ferneyhoughgeliebte: Yes it does, doesn't it!

Yes mangerton I had three 'extra' aunties, all friends of my mother. One was full of stories about the past and filled in some family gapsfor me. She died a few years ago, aged 99.

[Anna]

One so called cousin of mine is not a cousin at all. My GGGG Grandfather had two sons, William and George. I am descended directly from William. She is descended from George's wife's sister (so George's wife was her Great-Great Aunt) Therefore there is no blood link between us but we've decided being cousins is good. However, it could be that Bob's our Uncle!

GGG Grandpa William married twice and had a total of 13 children, we know from our family research that the children of his first and second marriages and the children of George's marriage were very entwined in business ventures and there is a marriage between both sides via my Great-Aunt!! There are a lot of second marriages, not divorce obviously in those days, but illness, and being left with broods of children it was necessary for widowers to get hitched again in order to care for the motherless children.

[vinteuil]

There are a lot of second marriages, not divorce obviously in those days, but illness, and being left with broods of children it was necessary for widowers to get hitched again in order to care for the motherless children.

... exackerly - Mme V would not exist had it not been for the passing of the 1907 Deceased Wife's Sister's Marriage Act - her grandpa had previously been married to the sister - who died (providentially) in 1907 leaving seven children - so he married her sister* ("to care for the motherless children") - and then produced two more with this sister - one of whom was Mme V's pa...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deceased_Wife's_Sister's_Marriage_Act_1907

* being RC they also needed to obtain ecclesiastical sanction, but that's another story....

[Anna]

Goodness vinteuil, how fortuitious for you and Mme V that they didn't delay passing that act otherwise she may not have existed and you would not be in a state of connubial bliss!!

I don't think we've ever had marriages of sisters of the deceased wife in our family. My widowed greatgrandfather married in his late 60s for the second time the young widow mother of his grandson's wife, which evidently was not a popular move within the family! My GGG Grandpa William's first wife died when she was 34, he promptly married again aged 40, after barely 6 months a 17 year old to whom, according to family folklore, he had been 'close to' for quite some years. Their third from last-born child, it turns out (from birth cert and schooling records), was in fact the child of their 14 year old daughter which, seeing as they were both of advancing age then puts in doubt the parentage of their last born two children. However, birth certs for those two do not contrdict but who knows? Anyway, at least the daughter was not kicked out and told never to darken their doorstep again ........ They do in fact seem to have been a very close knit family.