Originally posted by Pabmusic
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van Beethoven's worst mistake
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A typically earnest and thought-provoking plea from Mr Grew!
Though I was not around to read the Spectator in 1902, I remember discussing the issue of sex and marriage with some equally-idle colleagues in the late Sixties and I commented that the reason that people have sex and marry is due to lust, and the purpose of sex and marriage is the production and upbringing of children. I naively assumed that might be a view shared by most.
On the contrary, I was roundly turned on by the other members of the group and told that the purpose of sex and marriage had absolutely nothing to do with having children. It was all about 'love' (a much nicer-sounding word than lust) which, of course, at the time the great Beatles themselves claimed it was all we really needed, so who was I to argue?
As for Germanic opera, I've never been a huge fan, though, unlike Mr Grew, I can't see much wrong with the ancient institution of marriage ... at least a happy one!
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I recall that my main impression from Radio 3 'immersion' week of ALL of LvB's pieces was that there was a large number of pretty ordinary songs and other small works that were probably better left to return to richly-deserved obscurity..."...the isle is full of noises,
Sounds and sweet airs, that give delight and hurt not.
Sometimes a thousand twangling instruments
Will hum about mine ears, and sometime voices..."
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Richard Tarleton
Originally posted by P. G. Tipps View Postthe purpose of sex and marriage is the production and upbringing of children.
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Originally posted by Richard Tarleton View PostI think you were all wrong, Mr Tipps - lumping sex and marriage together is to confuse two different categories, one biological/evolutionary/genetic, the other cultural.
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Originally posted by ardcarp View PostI can think of several pieces by Beethoven which, if not mistakes exactly, seem to occupy a lesser place in his oeuvres. I can't bear The Consecration of the House, and the Choral Fantasy is just 'good in parts' IMVHO. But Fidelio? A great work. As an undergraduate coming up to university with no experience of opera whatsoever (if you discount G&S) I was completely hooked by Fidelio both for its music and its revolutionary politics.
HS
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Originally posted by Hornspieler View PostTotal agreement... and don't forget his "Battle" symphony (Wellington's Victory) and "King Stephen" overture.
HS
Oh! so it was…
But I don't agree about King Stephen, which is a 'nice' little work that doesn't sound much like LvB, but is still quite an unusual programme filler.
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I agree with Richard T about Fidelio. Having seen a number of different productions live and on DVD I just don't think it works on the stage. On the other hand the music definitely ought to be heard so for me this work is best served by radio broadcast or concert performance (or CD - for preference Furtwängler's studio recording).
And I think The Consecration of the House by some way LvB's most powerful and eloquent overture, as Bryn says a tribute to the composer he admired above all others, Handel.
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Given the plausibility of many opera plots I don't think Beethoven particularly ill-served by Fidelio. Marriage and devotion to a partner doesn't strike me as a necessarily poor choice either and the music contains wonderful things even if other works of LvB appeal more. What is Syd getting at?
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