.... is life a bsurd yes/no

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

Alyn is strongly mainstream this week [skip the first track finish baking yer scones] and also features the Harriott Quintet and a neat track by Tommy Flanagan .... i shall listen on the road to the south coast this pm on new car radio [dont ask ] looking forward to this and the following ...

Julian is doing us proud this afternoon

concert music by BBC Radio 3's New Generation Jazz Artist. saxophonist Trish Clowes, recorded at the Vortex jazz club in London. The set captures Trish performing with a stellar line-up including Gareth Williams on piano, Ryan Trebilcock on bass and Dave Hamblett on drums. Plus an interview and album profile with British Asian clarinetist Arun Ghosh who celebrates the release of his new recording 'A South Asian Suite'.

Geoffrey gets out his four classic albums sets this week to cover Dizzy Gillespie ... classic tracks they are too ....

Jon3 is unmissable again ... what are they putting in the water ... live Stanko and Gary Burton in duet ... way to go Jez ....

just love Johnny Richards arrangements ....

[french frank]

What is a bsurd?

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

an absurd typo [coat already on]

[Anna]

I'd assumed it was something to do with Illegitimi non carborundum?

[french frank]

I'd assumed it was something to do with Illegitimi non carborundum?

Isn't that about B'stards? Not quite the same as B'surds?

[eighthobstruction]

Jaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazz... .NOW.... THIS-IS- MY -KINDA-QUESTION....the answer....it's SQUERD!!!!....bogging squerd....


....thank you for your question CaL Da.... it made my minute....

[Alyn_Shipton]

Interesting Playlist from Geoffrey. Sadly looks as if the Jazz Library doesn't survive as a podcast. But here's the playlist if you happen to want to think about bit about how DG arrived at where GS starts (and some of the other stuff he did later): http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/jazzlibrary/pip/mwxjo/
And if you want to plough your way through (almost) every recording, disc by disc, track by track, then there is always this rather recently released "e-book":http://www.amazon.co.uk/Groovin-High.../dp/B000WLMADC

[Anna]

Prob is, Alyn, when the programme kicks off with Acker Bilk one wonders how many men dressed in beige in comfy slippers are listening .. I had three requests played by dear Geoffrey, one of which was Avishai Cohen, would something by him frighten the horses stabled in Radio 3 under the new regime?

[Ian Thumwood]

Listened to both JRR and JLU and both offered some interesting comparisons. The best tracks on JRR were the Ellington numbers and I liked the Harriot track too, even though I have this CD. The oddest track was the Artie Shaw recording of "The Blues" as this was not the one I had anticipated. I was expecting to hear the recording made around 1941 of the William Grant Still arrangement which has always fascinated me. The alternative track was a delight especially as I was not aware of this record. It reminded me a bit of two other recordings called "The blues", both of which featured the neglected Bunny Berigan. The first was a small group recording with Tommy Dorsey and Fats Waller which is amazing. A later recording made by the Metronome Allstars including a fair proportion of Bob Crobsy's band called "The blues" is also very good.

With regard to the JL programme, I found the content very mixed indeed. The best track was the David Murray record with the legendary Gregory Porter - this nailed on the head the reasoning for me just what makes American jazz so much better than what this country sometimes produces. The Arun Ghosh tracks were surprisingly good. The clarinetist is pretty deft with the pen and, apart from the last track, I liked this musician's work . It was nice to be acquainted with his ethos even if I find Julian Joseph to be a pretty oily interviewer. I don't really like him as a presenter - he reminds me too much of Keith Vaz.

As for the live session by Trish Clowes, I was interested in hearing this given the amount of good press S-A has given this musician on this board. I've enjoyed some of the Youtube links that have been posted. Unfortunately, I though the live set was pretty rank- I don't know if she was having an off-day but listening to her play nearly sent me to sleep. The pianist was the best thing about the concert yet the band never seemed to get going and the music failed to get off the ground as far as I was concerned. Her tone on both horns was pretty horrible too and whilst technically proficient, the compositions and solos weren't at all memorable. There was something about her tone that I really disliked - maybe it jarred after listening to Kenny Garrett in the car all day. I've heard quite a few bands perform in this anodyne style of jazz and I'm afraid that Clowes seems is no exception judging by this performance. Having just come back from seeing Gwylim Simcock, Steve Rodby, Adam Nussbaum (incredible) and Mike Walker produce a swinging, gritty and compelling gig that was honest to the tenets of jazz, Clowes seems like a clunking amateur. Sorry to disagree with the main bias of this board, but I felt her unswinging brand of jazz cold and unmoving. Probably the biggest disappointment for me on this board since the hype over Anthony Braxton on the old Radio 3 board. Some of her other output may be better but her quartet seems typical of the European response to jazz and whilst I think that there is a place to push the music in to technically complicated directions, her set didn't work for me. There are other musicians who can in this more abstract style and go in some very interesting places. Listen to something like David Binney's "Lifted Land" to demonstrate how this can be done. Maybe Clowes is a work in progress and , on another night, she might get in the zone. I'm afraid, judging by this set, I didn't hear enough to set her apart from what else I have heard lately. It's a shame as i think women like Nicole Mitchell, maria Schnieder, Geri Allen, Eri Yamamoto, Gretchen Parlato and maybe Mary Holvorsen have been setting the agenda in their fields - I think, on this evidence, Clowes is a long way away. This live set was a big let down.

Odd then to hear Simcock transformed in to a musician who has discarded the Classical pretentions of his earlier output for a stellar quartet that seems to have taken it's cues from PMG, John Scofield and MMW. His playing is far more direct these days and with the fabulous Nussbaum behind the kit, he seems to haved arrived as a jazz artist who can swing his pants off. I would have to add that Mike Walker is sensational and pulled out some amazing solos on his guitar. Every time I hear Nussbaum and Walker in a group, the music is always enhanced by their presence. A musician of Walker's ability and understanding is a million miles away from where Clowes is coming from yet he demonstrated an ability to play pretty outside and still swing. Shame that Walker seems so under-appreciated as I think he is one of the most exciting jazz musicians in this country and has been so for quite a long time now.

It is a good thing that the BBC is fostering the careers of younger jazz musicians and I can't argue against musicians being given a bigger profile and a national stage to establish themselves. In this respect, it is a good thing. However, have read the purple prose about Clowes over the last few months, I wonder how many other listeners remained unmoved by this performance. Sorry to be so negative about this set, but absolutely nothing about it stood out as compelling jazz. I would guess than Bluesnik at least would have had the same reservations.

[Alyn_Shipton]

Thing is Anna, I topped and tailed last week's programme with Gary Smulyan and Kit Downes, and nary a peep from anyone on the board. Put Acker first and you're worried about the new regime! The aim - while reflecting the week's crop of requests as fairly as possible - is to be less predictable than the chronological arrangement of the programme had become in recent years, by reverting to the kind of serendipitous sequence of tracks that was the norm in the days of Clayton and Fox. I do not believe - as far as my memory can tell - that anybody has requested Avishai Cohen since I've been presenting the programme, but I'd be happy to play something by him if anyone did.

[Quarky]

What is a bsurd?

Assumed it was related to the square root of 2, which cannot be expressed exactly.

In view of Ian's comments, must give Trish Clowes a hearing - she was pretty insipid on Jon3 earlier in the week. Switched off last night in view of the excessive chat time with Arun Gosh.

But I think Julian Joseph is the best presenter JLU has got. He's not perfect, but I guess we are looking for music presented, and insights into the music.

Abdullah Ibrahim of all people currently being played on R6M by Lauren Lavergne!

p.s These are S-A's comments on Trish's gig, which he managed toattend:

http://www.for3.org/forums/showthread.php?9390-kind-of-guitar-I-want-to-play-is-mean-mean-flicks&p=336845&highlight=#post336845

As far as I am concerned, she is in the mould of Wayne Shorter, which is no bad thing, and she provided something of a lead in to Il Trovatore, from the point of view of the programme planners.

[Ian Thumwood]

Old Ball

Having listened quite a bit to Wayne Shorter's quartet both on CD and live, I can appreciate the influence this current band has had on other musicians. Even before the group had been in existance for more than a couple of years, I heard Kenny Werner being very positive about their approach. I agree that this quartet has been probably the most influencial groups in jazz over the last 10-12 years. That said, Clowes' band just seemed to noodle along. There is a sense of risk and dram in the way that Shorter's quartet plays and the music really swings. I think Shorter is incapable of playing a phrase that doesn't swing. I think you have summed up Clowes precisely and "insipid" basically nails on the head what I thought of her music. It may have attempted to be as abstract as Shorter yet it fell a very long way behind alot of the jazz I've been hearing performed live of late. You might want to compare her with a similar, young saxophonist such as Logan Richardson to see just how wide the gulf is.

In some ways, it is good to see British musicians establish themselves on the global, contempoary jazz scene. There are some amazingly talented and interesting British jazz musicians out there and in the likes of someone such as John Escreet, you sense that they will be in the thick of things as the music develops over the next ten years. As for Clowes, if she was "on the top of her game" (to quote S-A), my expectations wouldn't be too great. Sounds like a student with good technique but no ideas and little connection with real jazz. Sometimes I feel we can be a bit partisan about home-grown players and there was nothing in Clowes's playing or writing that suggested she was worth a second listen. Go around the jazz festivals in Europe and this kind of stuff is pretty ubiquitous . Given what had be written by S-A and Calum about her work, I expected more, especially as I respect both of their opinions as passionate and discerning jazz fans. I'm sorry, but I would have to differ in my views. Trisha Clowes' set last night did absolutely nothing for me.

[Serial_Apologist]

Clowes' band just seemed to noodle along. There is a sense of risk and dram in the way that Shorter's quartet plays and the music really swings. I think Shorter is incapable of playing a phrase that doesn't swing. I think you have summed up Clowes precisely and "insipid" basically nails on the head what I thought of her music. It may have attempted to be as abstract as Shorter yet it fell a very long way behind alot of the jazz I've been hearing performed live of late. You might want to compare her with a similar, young saxophonist such as Logan Richardson to see just how wide the gulf is.

In some ways, it is good to see British musicians establish themselves on the global, contempoary jazz scene. There are some amazingly talented and interesting British jazz musicians out there and in the likes of someone such as John Escreet, you sense that they will be in the thick of things as the music develops over the next ten years. As for Clowes, if she was "on the top of her game" (to quote S-A), my expectations wouldn't be too great. Sounds like a student with good technique but no ideas and little connection with real jazz. Sometimes I feel we can be a bit partisan about home-grown players and there was nothing in Clowes's playing or writing that suggested she was worth a second listen. Go around the jazz festivals in Europe and this kind of stuff is pretty ubiquitous . Given what had be written by S-A and Calum about her work, I expected more, especially as I respect both of their opinions as passionate and discerning jazz fans. I'm sorry, but I would have to differ in my views. Trisha Clowes' set last night did absolutely nothing for me.

Having re-heard the set from the broadcast I now have to agree to some extent, Ian, and revise my sanguine earlier assessment, probably a consequence of being happy just to have got in to the gig, as mentioned previously. I was stuck right at the back of the club, behind a wall of people, most of whom, unusually, were taller than myself (I'm 5 ft 11), and the strongest impressions I got were that the drummer seemed too subdued, and the pianist too overwhelming in technique for Trish's understated though thoughtful improvising style. I remember thinking - though I didn't of course ask when I spoke to her in the break - why does she get through pianists so quickly? - Maybe I' being unfair here - I can't now remember who was with her at the end of 2011 when I first heard her group at the Amersham, but then she had Gwylym Simcock, who though technically well endowed tailors (no pun) his playing to suit the temper of his surrounds. I'd assumed Gwylym was still with her - wasn't he listed in the original note on the programme in RT? Gareth has a touch of the Herbies about him, courtesy a lot of jazzrock fusion, I think; it's no accident he has a band he called his Power Trio: there's something macho that comes across. He swamped Norma Winstone's voice during their brief musical partnership. I also wonder how being New Generation Artist is affecting Trish - there must be pressures to come up with goods involved; my view is that her predecessor Shabaka Hutchings came off worse from it: that chirpy-chuggy New Orleans type stuff with tuba basslines is really way below his capabilities, pretty unmemorable, and more suitable for dancing than listening. Whatever became of Tom Arthurs the Kenny Wheelerish young trumpet player who was Shabaka's NG predecessor? He had a great band with Ingrid Laubrock and Tim Giles in the early 2000s, but we rarely hear of him in the jazz field these days. BTW Shabaka was there, sitting so unobtrusively right behind us that when standing up at the end, his six foot whatever frame elicited a gasp of surprise and delight from all around me, and a beautiful smile in return from Shabs!

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

listened to both JRR and JLU with great attention as i drove down the A! and around the M25

Ian i agree with both you and S_A ...it was a poorish session from Clowes, but i have heard much better on the steam radio hence my undiminished enthusiasm for her work .... she will be interesting imho

Agreed also about the Ellington tracks on JRR, put the Kenny Ball shambles to complete shame ...

Tommy Flanagan is a poet innit

disagreed about the David Murray gospel pastiche, much preferred James Carter on the Kansas City soundtrack ...

Arun Ghosh was quite fab i thought, but JJ's interview technique is sometimes sharp sometimes rather obsequious ... great two and a half hours, the miles flew by

even listened to the first half of Trovatore until it became too much [the Anvils did for me really] and then played a Dizzy Gillespie cd [The DG Story - includes the album with the cover art above]

the sound of the Ellington Orchestra in the piece from Anatomy of Murder was awesome, just awesome .... the cymbal shivered my timbers!

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

Most all of it left me cold tho the Flanagan track was up to his mark.

Ms. Tris washed over me as I finished clearing the spare room...just a nothing and the Murray track was warmed over 1971. Ckout the actual stuff that came out of Detroit with Marcus Belgrave etc if you want that done with conviction.

From this moment on...its gotta be UTuba.

"Its Utuba or nothing at all"
...Ray Draper Quintet.

BN.