Chet Baker JL 22.i.11

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

..i am not a fan and have often hotly debated Chet with El Senor so in a sense of pure mischief check out the following:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PqLmaDiGag&feature=fvst

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZu-CA17q3I&feature=related

Jimmy Owens first, Chet second ...chosen so they are both at similar late periods ....

what strikes me is the different nature of the careers and personalities of two musicians, one of notoriety, the other relative obscurity yet when you listen to Owens one wonders why ...


however look froward to the early stuff with Art ....

[charles t]

Safe to say, Calum, that Chet Baker is many times more popular now than during his mostly dismal lifetime. For myself, his 'less-is-more' approach to the trumpet has consistently kept me in suspense waiting for that next chord...an unmistakable style.

Your thread might be the place to mention the private-eye novel (by Bill Moody) Looking For Chet Baker.

A brief aside: Bill Moody, is a pianist and professor at Univ of Nevada, Las Vegas. I brought some of his novels on a trip to be signed and called the William Moody listed in the phonebook. Received several calls from a person by that name, who eventually made it known he was not the Bill Moody I was seeking. Guy was a 'throw-back' hippy but did know of Barbara Thompson's Paraphanalia.

http://www.amazon.com/Looking-Chet-Baker-Horne-Mystery/dp/1590585739/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1295718758&sr=1-1

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

here is the Deep in a Dream:

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=yHQZAQAAIAAJ&q=chet+baker+deep+in+a+dream &dq=chet+baker+deep+in+a+dream&hl=en&ei=1yU8TeO-M8G3hQej5a3mCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnu m=1&ved=0CCwQ6AEwAA

interesting programme which did not endear me any further to his playing, a capable natural musician who was not the most functional of personalities .... i will throw no bricks here since i share in his lack of application and diligence, and periods of substance abuse, which although these things blight one's existence, seem mysteriously and profoundly part of one's nature ...

if one ignores the hype around his notoriety, looks, and Hollywood escapades, one is left with his playing .... i'll take Jimmy Owens ... or Conte Candoli or Jon Eardly or Jack Sheldon or Shorty Rogers ...all of whom on any given night on a bandstand would give Chet a run for his money .... and much prefer Mulligan with Art Farmer .... because that is how one must take a player like Chet ... on a given night on a bandstand [if he was there at all and could bring and use a horn]

a worthwhile essay though, it might have selected a few other recordings [Prestige sides, the Blue Note Reissues of the Freeman Quartet] but this would not have advanced the thesis much ... gratitude to Alyn and his contributor Ian Smith

[charles t]

Always good to get your feedback, Calum. I was fortunate to catch the Mulligan Quartet with Art Farmer! The venue was an outdoor pavilion on the North Shore of Chicago and the group was the opening act for The Kingston Trio and all these suburban types were chattering like the prov. magpies and destiny led me from my seat to this small theatre where the concert was being piped in! As I sat alone, digging...

If you have ever seen a copy of the video Let's Get Lost - Jack Sheldon talks about how he hated Chet's natural ability...what he (Sheldon) had to work so hard for. (Plus Chet's scroo-a-ble pickings...).

No argument on all your listings...glad to see Jon Eardly cited. Shorty was a legend. In fact, any of the Lighthouse cats. Did see - not here - but at the aforementioned Ravinia, a (Lighthouse) reunion group with Conte.

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

Calum ~ I'm not going to re-run the WW1 Bored Wars!

My defence of Chet is solely based around the fact that he DID make some very fine (and moving sesions) and wasn't the dipsy, Dean-lite, posey and tenth rate musical figure so often described by those who rarely LISTEN to him. His big problem (amongst many) was that he made so many tepid sessions for the "cash of it" - e.g. the 50s Riversides stand out where he almost nods off, so that his reputation suffers.

Was he a Miles, Art Farmer or a Kenny Dorham? (although Kenny liked him). Absolutely NOT. I was listening again to Lee Morgan's early Bluenotes after the programme and Lee even at 18 could have taken him apart at that game. But on his own terms, doing what he wanted to, he cut some gems. And in his own way had a quiet integrity. He did care.

Once again, jazz is about individual expression. Surely?

Anyway, a very enjoyable programme in what is truly a superb series. Thank you Alyn. Minor gripe - I thought the reason Art Pepper detested Chet was that Chet was (often) a "nark", happy to turn other people over if his collar was felt. This is backed up by Laurie Pepper in "Deep in A dream".

Missing sessions?

The "Diane" duo album with Paul Bley - endlessly fascinating.

The co-leader album with Warne Marsh - Chet more than holds his own.

The live quartet album with Lee Konitz recorded at Ornette's loft (India Navigation) - a fine example of Chet's strengths and open-mindedness. "Willow" is a gem.

BN.

( I was once "on stage" with Chet - other boasts are available to download )

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

By the way - vastly under-rated trumpet players of that era - Ira Sullivan, Johnny Coles and as I'm suddenly (and belatedly) finding, Red Rodney.

BN.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

Er ... EL Senor i agree with you ....

..and not just expression, but a cool dry style

...btw this is a very commercial CTI album but it pairs Chet B with Paul Desmond, now that is a Martini!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrynrQf1fPg

..cover tells a story eh ...

[Ian Thumwood]

Been listening to the first part of the programme on the I-player but so far find the most interesting elements about the tracks selected are the other soloists! Twardzik hs always appealed but the likes of Frank Strozier have always seemed intriguing - certainly a soloist who played with more fire than Baker. The duet with Paul Bley sounds fascinating as it is such an odd coupling. You wouldn't think that this could work. I think Calum has summed up exactly how I feel about Chet Baker. When I first stated to play on a quintet about 20 years ago, I listened to his music as this was very much in the style that the other musicians aspired to. Previously, I had leapt from Be-bop / Miles & Gil straight through to the contemporary scene of the 1980's without really checking out what went on between. The local trumpet player was very much into the lyrical approach to improvisation although I cannot recall him being that much of a fan. Having acquired one CD, I never felt compelled to explore any further. As was implied in one of the earlier threads, there are so many other better players out there to check out that Baker is very much way down on the list. It is not helped that his approach is so marooned in it's era that even his more recent records seem like the kind of music you hear played behind a test card. (Feel the same about the Anat Cohen CD I am playing at the moment, "Noir." ) I think it was Brian Priestley who descrived Baker as being like a Modern Jazz Red Nichols and whilst the comparison is wide of the mark regarding their chosen life styles, there seems a good deal of truth in the musical merits. Odd how Baker has endured (perhaps due to the morbidity about his drug addiction / romantic notions on the same) whereas Nichols is rarely mentioned these days.

The CTI Chet / Paul Desmond album would be Jazz Hell for me. I can see the attraction of the lyrical aspect of his playing but when you have heard the likes of Art Farmer or Tom Harrell, he just seems like a talented amateur who got lucky in comparison. It is particularly disappointing that someone like Baker should be celebrated at the expense of Tom Harrell - a soloist who is no less lyrical but definately more inclined to take risks.

[Quarky]

. Odd how Baker has endured (perhaps due to the morbidity about his drug addiction / romantic notions on the same) .

That's exactly how I felt about the programme, and why I complained to Jazz Library. It left me feeling profoundly depressed (admittedly I wasn't in the best of moods to start with).

But isn't it a bad advert for Jazz?

[Ian Thumwood]

Just finished listening to the programme.

I thought that Ian Smith was very sympathetic to Baker and the case was presented well, although the later work seems as erratic as I had believed it to be. For me, the best track was easily the one with Richard Twardzick whose playing sounded far more robust than on the Lonehill CD I have of his work. Shame he killed himself through drugs as I think his playing would have blossomed in the more radical jazz of the 1960's and he may have become Boston's answer to Paul Bley. Oddly, the Lonehill disc shows him very much under the thrall of Bud Powell as well as having an ear (and pen) for the quirky, jazz original. I think the main problem with Baker is the fact that is playing, whilst melancholy, is just too bright. It rapidly becomes aural wall-paper. The track with Art Pepper seemed to suffer because of this although I love the altoist's later work. There are some nice harmonic twists and contours in Baker's playing and you can see how he might have influenced some more capable, modern players. The track "Nightbird" was fascinating as it sounded just like the kind of music Tom Harrell writes but the assurance was lacking in Baker's playing. I am a fan of Harrell both as a soloist and especially as a gifted composer and comparing him with Baker, I find Harrell more enthusiastic about taking harmonic chances whereas sometimes Baker sound like his is feeling his way along a piece, perhaps slightly less confident? Maybe the fact that Harrell can be unsettling in his choice of notes keeps the listener on his toes? Interesting to see contrast that Harrell too has his own problems he has had to overcome and given that his aren't self-inflicted, I hope that he receives as sympathetic a reviewer as Ian Smith when his turn comes up for JL. Don't have any time for Baker as a human being - not interesting, not romantic and inexcusable.

I did enjoy the programme which was thought-provoking although I am sorry that I wasn't convinced that the music was really that special. Nice to hear the trumpeter tackle more Hard Bop and "contemporary" styles of jazz but you just think that a wealth of other players have done this so much better. For me, one Chet CD is enough.

Incidently, I mean't to pick up on the comment about the trumpeter Johnny Coles. When I first heard him with Gil Evans on the "Out of the cool" album and later the discs of jazz standards, I was blown away by his piping quality of his sound. However, I have subsequently heard some of his Blue Note material and been very disappointed. He later returned to guest with one of Gil's later , 1980's bands on a live set recorded at the "Sweet Basil" and he was really in decline as a player by that stage.

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

EH? It would be a VERY short list otherwise!

Bob Brookmeyer (in my one encounter with him, I foolishly asked if he had read "Deep in a dream") replied with "spirit"! ..."I don''t want to read that stuff. Chet was a beautiful natural musician, what he did in his personal life was his choice and NO business of yours or anyone else."

Ian - Check out Johnny Coles "New Morning" quartet set with Horace Parlan. VERY fine.

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

Sorry - the first part of the above referred to the "bad advert for jazz" quote.

BN. (clean and youthful)

[charles t]

Being repetitive with old time bordees, but when I had Art Pepper inscribe his autobio - Straight Life - he asked what I thought of it. I could only reply:

"I'm amazed that you are still alive!'

Then he told me he intended to keep living - now that he had so much to live for.

He made it for two more years...

[charles t]

Here's Laurie Pepper talking about a proposal to have Straight Life on the silver screen:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=16480615

[Tenor Freak]

I caught only a part of this prog...very good though, must listen to the lot.

I was particularly amused by the story that he hooked up with a Belgian musician who just happened to have inherited a pharmacy....