The write stuff

[Ian Thumwood]

SA

The interesting thing with the interview with Laura Jurd was the disconnection between what she was saying about the music and what the listening experience was. As I said earlier, one of the tunes was just a vamp over one chord and this doesn't really evoke a great compositional mind at work in my opinion. With the improvisation, you are either "off" the key of "on" the key - the whole process is just binary and not really interesting in 2018. I am aware of her writing more through-composed works and it would be interesting to hear what the motors are for her with the work she produces which is more classical-leaning.

I agree that there is a problem with improvisation having a relationship with the material it is based upon but when the composers and soloists are in sympatico, the music really works. For the most part, I think this happens with jazz composition and has never really been an issue. You just have to thing of people like Ellington, Gil Evans, Monk, Dameron etc as they have all managed to find soloists to buy in to their vision. It is something that fascinates me and the whole compositional issue is one I find increasingly interesting and rewarding to listen to. The idea that someone has composed a framework for improvisation is certainly more rewarding than the old concept of blowing on a set of changes. Living things to chance is a risky business but as soon as someone starts notating ideas and reflecting / revising them, the end result will generally be superior. There have historically been small groups who have thrived on the alchemy of the unexpected whilst I would suggest that more contemporary styles of jazz have been marked by the extent of composition. Given that there is unlikely to ever be another Coltrane, I really feel that composers are starting to have the upper hand in jazz albeit I think that there is a current problem insofar that many younger jazz musicians think they can compose and this is not always the case. For me, the excitement is discovering those musicians who can write and are able to do so that genuinely adds to what jazz can be about. Whether you are talking about Henry Threadgill, Alan Ferber, Maria Schneider, Steve Coleman, Belmondo, John Hollenbeck, Steve Lehman, Mike Gibbs, Mike Westbrook or Michael Leonhart, a lot of the jazz I have listened to recently is indicative that jazz composition is in a markedly strong position in 2018. Sorry, I don't find Jurd's music to be in the higher echelons of jazz at this point in time albeit I think she will be a far more interesting player in about 15 years time.

[Serial_Apologist]

I agree that there is a problem with improvisation having a relationship with the material it is based upon but when the composers and soloists are in sympatico, the music really works. For the most part, I think this happens with jazz composition and has never really been an issue. You just have to thing of people like Ellington, Gil Evans, Monk, Dameron etc as they have all managed to find soloists to buy in to their vision.

Yes but Duke Ellington - and I would argue this also applies to Gil Evans - is always said, probably correctly, to have composed music with the playing style of the musician(s) to be showcased on them - a case of improvisation being acknowledged as the leader, Ellington the composer moulding their approach into his design, so as to produce that wonderful unity, demonstrating his insightfulness and immersion in their soundworld.

Sorry, I don't find Jurd's music to be in the higher echelons of jazz at this point in time albeit I think she will be a far more interesting player in about 15 years time.

Well we're in agreement about that! Some of Laura's best playing has been in other groups and combinations drawn together with, eg Evan Parker, which are of an improvisatory nature, making my point for me! I would still maintain that the ambition of any gifted jazz musician is to acquire his or her own personality as an improviser; it seems to me that if composition is from now on to be the main driver of change and advance, the emphasis on composition might be contributing to the unlikelihood of another John Coltrane ever emerging! Self-expression in the context of feedback and mutual support is the main point of jazz, in my view, and not improvisation as a mere add-on to somebody's carefully confected score, with the (classical tradition) implication of copyright, rehearsal, and the "perfect" version whose achievement is the all-important objective pushing spontaneity to one side.

The manner in which black American musicians evolved a performance style with its own idiom to be able to challenge the omnipotence of the score and the idea that complexity could only be achieved through scrupulous pre-deliberation was one in the eye for classical music's conviction in its own superiority, and yet another signifier of colonial justification. Yes, composition is great or can be in the light of improvisation and what it does to elicit inter-musician and musician-audience responsiveness, and with that principle in mind the acquisition of reading and writing skills was a major plus in elevating jazz to being on a par with the finest music in any other genre or tradition, including, indeed especially classical music in a culture that had either marginalised and demeaned the achievements of black people or nicked their ideas. But I don't think Laura Jurd will evolve her own improvising style in the context of Dinosaur!

[Ian Thumwood]

The manner in which black American musicians evolved a performance style with its own idiom to be able to challenge the omnipotence of the score and the idea that complexity could only be achieved through scrupulous pre-deliberation was one in the eye for classical music's conviction in its own superiority, and yet another signifier of colonial justification. Yes, composition is great or can be in the light of improvisation and what it does to elicit inter-musician and musician-audience responsiveness, and with that principle in mind the acquisition of reading and writing skills was a major plus in elevating jazz to being on a par with the finest music in any other genre or tradition, including, indeed especially classical music in a culture that had either marginalised and demeaned the achievements of black people or nicked their ideas. But I don't think Laura Jurd will evolve her own improvising style in the context of Dinosaur!

I listen a lot of historic jazz recordings and I can't disagree more with the idea that musicians were trying to challenge the omnipotence of the score. I see jazz as progressing by taking in a number of challenges. You can pick up on a number of themes such as developing more complex rhythms, a broader harmonic context and indeed how you go about improvising. However, running parallel with these developments has been the question of how to compose for jazz ensembles. It has been a question that has been asked since the early 1920's and is still being asked today. I don't think the likes of Duke Ellington, Fletcher Henderson, Don Redman, John Nesbitt or Bill Challis shackled the soloists in their arrangements. For me, the struggle of how to integrate soloists in to a composition to make it a "whole" is an essential part of jazz development. Over the last month I have been listening a lot to Fletcher Henderson and McKinney's Cottonpickers and it is clear that both bands were involved in musical problem solving like trying to mike the ensembles swing, how to write to a new instrument such as the saxophone and how to construct arrangements so that the impetus of the music was not compromised. These were genuine issues for arrangers. Both black and white musicians were not trying to escape from being tied to a score. I agree that musicians were trying to evolve and find new ways to express themselves, but this was also mirrored by the composition of the time and throughout the evolution if jazz. It has always been there and as jazz develops, composition has been looking at resolving the same issues and problems in parallel. The idea that jazz musicians are somehow trying to break away from composition to gain their musical liberty is one that I would suspect most musicians of all generations would not recognise. Even when Be-bop was to the fore and jazz sought far freer expression, the likes of Dizzy Gillespie still chose to go this through the vehicle of a big band. Composition and large ensembles are both core ingredients of what jazz is about and this will always be the case.