What Jazz are you listening to now?

[Ian Thumwood]

Joe Henderson - "Big Band" (Verve, 1996).

NP: "Serenity"

Bruce

I have 4 of Joe Henderson's Verve releases from the 1990s including the Big Band album which was not as well recevied by the critics when it was initially released. Henderson is a bit of favourite of mine and i think that the big band disc is actually very under-rated. If anything, it is the Strayhorn album which is slightly over-praised - the best two being the Miles Davis tribute album and the Jobim disc . The arrangements are quite clean and punchy. It was not Henderson's only effort with a big band having previously worked with the likes of George Gruntz and Ernie Wilkons. The final Verve album which covered Porgy & Bess was the only disappointment, I think.

I have been playing Henderson's associate Kenny Dorham's 1955 album "Afro-Cuban." The disc is one of the early Blue Note records where the label had not really been able to hit it's stride. The first session includes a battery of percussion which do not really connect with the horns. It is very dated and of it's time. I find that the mixture of Latin music and jazz is something that musicians can frequently get wrong and the lack of montounos and a proper sense of clave means that this freqently ends up falling on it's face. I had an Abersold play-a-long of Bird goes Latin which is practically impossible to play and made me appreciate the level of skill necessary to blend bop / jazz with Latin music. I love Latin Jazz and think it is an oeuvre that is seriously overlooked and misunderstood. Most people seem to treat it as being exotica but the reality is it that is is not something to be treated lightly. For me, Latin jazz does for rhythm what Bach does for counterpoint. The rest of the set is better and ditches the extra percussion but depsite the employment of Cecil Payne, J J Johnson and Hank Mobley, Dorham remains the principle soloist of interest. The biggest disappointment is the writing which is a bit ordinary by Dorham's high standards. Only "KD's Motion" and "Venita's Dance" are really memorable themes. It is fascinating how Kenny Dorham evolved into being such as a significant composer. There is a sense that he needed tje last vestiges of be-bop to finish before jazz have evolved to the point where his style of writing was more suited to the direction jazz took in the late 50s and mid 60s when he found his voice. If you can nab a copy of Walter Davis Jr's "30 compositions by Kenny Dorham" you can start to appreciate what his music was all about. A really interesting player.

[Stanfordian]

‘Blue & Sentimental – Ike Quebec
with Grant Green, Paul Chambers & Philly Joe Jones
Blue Note (1961)

[Tenor Freak]

Bruce

I have 4 of Joe Henderson's Verve releases from the 1990s including the Big Band album which was not as well recevied by the critics when it was initially released. Henderson is a bit of favourite of mine and i think that the big band disc is actually very under-rated. If anything, it is the Strayhorn album which is slightly over-praised - the best two being the Miles Davis tribute album and the Jobim disc . The arrangements are quite clean and punchy. It was not Henderson's only effort with a big band having previously worked with the likes of George Gruntz and Ernie Wilkons. The final Verve album which covered Porgy & Bess was the only disappointment, I think.

Hi Ian. From what I gather, the Big Band CD was recorded in two sessions, one in 1992 and one in 1994/5. Of course, critics are often wrong and the reputation of the Big Band CD has grown over the years since, especially with musicians. Mostly it comprises Joe's own hits (Isotope, Inner Urge, Recorda Me etc) with a couple of his favourite standards, such as Without A Song which he played a lot (there's a brilliant version on The Kicker). I particularly enjoy the arrangements of Inner Urge, Black Narcissus and Serenity, but the arrangement of Recorda Me is notable as well. This is a recording I go back to quite a lot and for me is the highlight of Joe's final years as a player.

I can't say I followed Joe's Verve years very closely, I did borrow the Miles tribute CD from the library once and enjoyed that somewhat. Joe seemed somewhat miffed that, despite winning four Grammys, he felt he didn't receive the recognition he was due, as there was always someone else who was the hot tenor player of the day, whilst Joe's style didn't change a lot from the Blue Note days. The only thing that changed was his tone which softened a lot from the hard and rubbery sound he got in the 1960s, probably thanks to his heavy smoking. Apparently he was cheesed off with Brecker getting all the glory and gigs and expressed this in an interview once, which upset Brecker quite a bit it seems, because he idolised Joe.

As a side-note I am revisiting a bunch of Joe's solo transcriptions from the Don Sickler book. Currently working on "Jinrikisha" and have started on "Recorda Me" from his debut Blue Note LP.

Oh sorry: back to the topic - NP: Joe Henderson "Without A Song" from "The Kicker" (Milestone, 1967) - he's at his absolute peak here. Great LP.

[Serial_Apologist]

It is fascinating how Kenny Dorham evolved into being such as a significant composer. There is a sense that he needed the last vestiges of be-bop to finish before jazz have evolved to the point where his style of writing was more suited to the direction jazz took in the late 50s and mid 60s when he found his voice. If you can nab a copy of Walter Davis Jr's "30 compositions by Kenny Dorham" you can start to appreciate what his music was all about. A really interesting player.

The "really interesting player" being a salient afterthought there, but one central I believe to Kenny Dorham's playing in the post-bop era, when he truly seemed to find his place, even more than his arranging.

[Joseph K]

Miles Davis - Bitches Brew

[Stanfordian]

‘Rollin' with Leo’ – Leo Parker
with Dave Burns, Bill Swindell, John Acea, Stan Conover/Al Luca & Wilbert Hogan/Purnell Rice
Blue Note (1961, first released 1980)

[Stanfordian]

‘Workout’ – Hank Mobley
with Grant Green, Wynton Kelly, Paul Chambers & Philly Joe Jones
Blue Note (1961)

[Joseph K]

[elmo]

Bobby Hutcherson Til Then
Bobby with Herbie Hancock, Albert Stinson, Joe Chambers playing a lovely composition somewhat reminescent of "Maiden Voyage"

Albert Stinson a very fine Bassist that died young.

https://youtu.be/OrJEsfO46jw

elmo

[Stanfordian]

‘Bluesnik’ – Jackie McLean
with Freddie Hubbard, Kenny Drew, Doug Watkins & Pete La Roca
Blue Note (1961)

[Ian Thumwood]

Bobby Hutcherson Til Then
Bobby with Herbie Hancock, Albert Stinson, Joe Chambers playing a lovely composition somewhat reminescent of "Maiden Voyage"

Albert Stinson a very fine Bassist that died young.

https://youtu.be/OrJEsfO46jw

elmo

This album typifies for me an observation I wanted to make earlier this week. "Oblique" is a terrific album although "Happenings" strikes me as being even better. I appreciate that everyone has their favourite amingst the Blue Note catalogue, but listening to Wayne Shorter's mid 60s output this week, it does make you realise that many musicians and albums on this label are seriously overlooked. "Schizaphrenia" and " The Soothsayer" both strike as being fantastic albums from so many points of view. There seems to be a wealth of compositional material by Shorter which has gone under the radar. Tunes like "Lost" and "The big push" are not exactly standards but they deserve to be better known. You can also look at these albums from the point of view of the sidemen and reach some unusual conclusions. I cannot understand why Joe Chambers is not recognized as one of the great drummers of this era. Every time I pick up an album with him on her is sensational. The other musicians who have stood out for me in recent listening are James Spalding (a musician I have seen with David Murray in the past but who is incredible on the albums by Freddie Hubbard and Wayne Shorter where he is a sideman) and Curtis Fulller. In my opinion the trombonist is a player brought in to make groups sound better. I am a big fan of his playing.

[Joseph K]

Bought yesterday (see the latest jazz purchases thread) - https://outsideinmusic.bandcamp.com/album/riverside

... and it's just as good as I'd hoped!

[Ian Thumwood]

Picking up from the sentiments of the Albert Ayler thread, I have been playing the Kirk Knuffke 2015 album "Arms and Hands" which features the cornetist fronting an unlikely trio of Bill Goodwin on drums and Mark Helia on bass. Some of the tracks feature additional musicians such as trombonist Brian Drye and saxophonists Daniel Carter and Jeff Lederer. I suppose the music take it's cues from Ornette Coleman's celebrated quartet and there is something about the fragmentary nature of the compositions which underscore this. From recollection I believe if was Elmo who has previously posted enthusiastically about Knuffke and this disc illustrates for me how the concepts of Free Jazz have radically changed. The band is tight and I feel that the music works because of the fact that the musicians are listening to each other so intently. Drummer Bill Goodwin is probably more reknown from wotking with Phil Woods' quartet and has also worked with Woody Herman too, I have never heard him in this kind of context and the interaction with Helias is so good that they are the main attraction. There are moments when the music seems quite exploratory but, with the flip of a coin, the band changes to driving time / no chnages mode. You sense that Goodwin relished the opportunity to play in this context which is at the same time sharp yet fluid. The soloing is also really precise , Knuffke coming across as an earthoer incarnation of his former teacher Ron Miles.

I think the other characteristic is the fact that the music is fun. There is no political message to underscore the music. The music stands by it's own merit's. There are moments where the juxtaposition of the differing approaches seem very odd. The combination of Daniel Carter's reedy alto playing which evokes Marshal Allen to my ears is at odds with Goodwin's drumming but I love the fact that this line up was possible. The choice of personal is so outrageous that the music becomes compelling. You are really drawn in to the music and the result seems really personal with no one compromising their identities for the sake of consistency. Hearing these unlikely scenarios is testament to Knuffke's broad-ranging taste and evident of his desire to get the disperate styles of his musical mentors (Goodwin and Helias in particular) into a studio together and to see how they react. Some tracks have a West Coast sunniness to them but the results are never less than fascinating. It is a very wierd choice of sideman on Knuffke's part and the tipping of the hat towards Ornette certainly piqued my interest.

[elmo]

Ian - You are quite right about Wayne Shorter's mid 60's output. The quality and amount of outstanding compositions he turned out was staggering, including songs he never recorded himself like "Edda" with fine Lee Morgan and Joe Henderson.

https://youtu.be/nIvCpi7PToM

elmo

[elmo]

Picking up from the sentiments of the Albert Ayler thread, I have been playing the Kirk Knuffke 2015 album "Arms and Hands" which features the cornetist fronting an unlikely trio of Bill Goodwin on drums and Mark Helia on bass. Some of the tracks feature additional musicians such as trombonist Brian Drye and saxophonists Daniel Carter and Jeff Lederer. I suppose the music take it's cues from Ornette Coleman's celebrated quartet and there is something about the fragmentary nature of the compositions which underscore this. From recollection I believe if was Elmo who has previously posted enthusiastically about Knuffke and this disc illustrates for me how the concepts of Free Jazz have radically changed. The band is tight and I feel that the music works because of the fact that the musicians are listening to each other so intently. Drummer Bill Goodwin is probably more reknown from wotking with Phil Woods' quartet and has also worked with Woody Herman too, I have never heard him in this kind of context and the interaction with Helias is so good that they are the main attraction. There are moments when the music seems quite exploratory but, with the flip of a coin, the band changes to driving time / no chnages mode. You sense that Goodwin relished the opportunity to play in this context which is at the same time sharp yet fluid. The soloing is also really precise , Knuffke coming across as an earthoer incarnation of his former teacher Ron Miles.

I think the other characteristic is the fact that the music is fun. There is no political message to underscore the music. The music stands by it's own merit's. There are moments where the juxtaposition of the differing approaches seem very odd. The combination of Daniel Carter's reedy alto playing which evokes Marshal Allen to my ears is at odds with Goodwin's drumming but I love the fact that this line up was possible. The choice of personal is so outrageous that the music becomes compelling. You are really drawn in to the music and the result seems really personal with no one compromising their identities for the sake of consistency. Hearing these unlikely scenarios is testament to Knuffke's broad-ranging taste and evident of his desire to get the disperate styles of his musical mentors (Goodwin and Helias in particular) into a studio together and to see how they react. Some tracks have a West Coast sunniness to them but the results are never less than fascinating. It is a very wierd choice of sideman on Knuffke's part and the tipping of the hat towards Ornette certainly piqued my interest.

Thank you for the Kirk Knuffke recommendation. I was not aware of this album, I have played some of the excerpts and will buy a copy. Here is a short documentary about the making of "Arms and hands"

https://youtu.be/HMEbhvdgLUM

elmo