...Time Will Tell .... good news for Giuffre fans

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

in today's NY Times

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

in today's NY Times

Looks tres good. Ive got a French CD of the trio live in Paris and when Jimmy starts "stretching" and abstracting, whistles shouts and hate mail erupt from the audience. Wot no tomatoes?

BN.

There is some very strong tenor on it that sounds like early 60s Rollins...that went down OK.

[Ian Thumwood]

Calum

There was a very favourable review of this new CD on "All about jazz" a few weeks ago. The music sounds terrific , not least from the point of view of hearing Guiffre record with unfamiliar sidemen.
I like that NYC Times article and it is good to read that obvious connections between Guiffre and the interesting music in helped to spawn from the 1980's onwards such as Bill Frisell's own work as well as the recent disc by Dave Douglas which also features Steve Swallow. Nit heard this yet albeit I am an avid collector of his records.

Guiffre is severely under-appreciated and a probably the most significant musical force to emerge amongst the white saxophonists who materialised in the 1940's along with Lee Konitz and the sincere music of the great Art Pepper. Guiffre's music tapped in to the Americana style that has also crept up in works by the likes of Gary Burton, Bill Frisell, some Keith Jarrett and most obviously Pat Metheny. I don't know who else was really doing this in jazz prior to Guiffre but it has slowly asserted itself in to the jazz mainstream.

Not too surprised to read the Paul Bely quote as he always seems to be a bit outspoken and, then once you have reflected on his comments, you realise just how right he often is. The trio with Bley / Swallow / Guiffre similarly influenced a lot of subsequent jazz and if it had no bearing on the more dominant black voices within the free jazz movement, I've read that it hugely influenced Manfred Eicher and the ethos behind his ECM label.

Guiffre is an odd figure to place for me. I think his arrangement of "The four brothers" is simply one of the best big band charts ever composed and like the arrangement of Gillespie's "Manteca," it has transcended totally the era in which it was written. However, increasingly Guiffre does seem a character out of his time and , like Konitz, perhaps has a greater connection with more contemporary styles of jazz that he undoubtedly influenced. It is hard for me to think of Jimmy Guiffre as being of the same generation of the likes of Getz, Sims, Cohn, etc and easier for me to embrace his music as part of contemporary jazz.

Glad that this thread has drawn attention to these records. I would be interested to hear any feedback from anyone who has snapped up this double CS. (and the new Dave Douglas for that matter.)

[Serial_Apologist]

I always felt Jimmy Giuffre must have turned to that way of playing the clarinet in the early 60s after hearing Benny Goodman's extraordinary clarinet on that playing of Bartok's "Contrasts" with the composer in 1940. It amazes me that Goodman did it so well, even granted that the music was all written down. So I disagree with what Paul Bley said there, and Ian above.

There is definitely a school of post-Giuffre free clarinet that's been in existence for a good while - and I'm not talking of Tony Coe or Peter Brotzmann. A British clarinet player was introduced by Derek Bailey at the Company performances of 1988, and at Outside-In, in near-disbelief we saw this little boy of 13 playing his shorts off with all these middle-aged free improv guys, sounding very like and just as fluid as Giuffre. He's still around - more expressionistic now than back then, but you'll still hear jazz phrasing at various points in these two free performances:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9J6npz-6w4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBm4mhA8_e8

Possibly they reconsecrated the church after that second performance. Only joking.

Alex also plays wild post-Hendrix guitar in improv settings that have had me reaching for the earplugs. Here's his site:

http://www.alexward.bandcamp.com

[MarkG]

There is definitely a school of post-Giuffre free clarinet that's been in existence for a good while

Of which Francois Houle might be one...

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

old style Giuffre

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

in between Giuffre

it will blow yer head away!

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

the '65 trio with Richard Davis & Joe Chambers [wow]

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

the '65 trio with Richard Davis & Joe Chambers [wow]

Yeah ok, but how about some Woody Giuffre?

BN.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

nah Jimmy is the man

[BLUESNIK'S REVOX]

He was a surprisingly "robust" tenor player....obviously listened a lot to late 50s Rollins. Some great just pre free live tracks out there.

BN.