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[Guest]

How sad, on returning after some time, to note that the unpleasantness is still going strong. From the same people, of course supported later by the same members of the clique.

[Barbirollians]

Absolutely

Many think that JS Bach is a great composer, but you don't see threads trying to persuade others, or suggesting that if you don't like Bach you're a ... (insert suitable term of your choice)

You do see threads like that about Lachenmann though

[jayne lee wilson]

You do see threads like that about Lachenmann though

Ooh, good! Can we take that one up again? Seconds away...

[richardfinegold]

How sad, on returning after some time, to note that the unpleasantness is still going strong. From the same people, of course supported later by the same members of the clique.

Yes, you Brits take your discussions about music very seriously. I'd hate to see what invective flies when you argue about something of real importance, such as what is an appropriate name for the newest Royal Infant.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Yes, you Brits take your discussions about music very seriously. I'd hate to see what invective flies when you argue about something of real importance, such as what is an appropriate name for the newest Royal Infant.

Hey now! Just watch it, matey! We take our spellings seriously too.

[Arcades Project]

':

[Nick Armstrong]

the clique

I don't buy this at all. The word seems to be used occasionally by individual Forumites who chuck in an over-the-top and offensive (and often, it seems, wilfully provocative) post, and find regular users of the Forum united against that behaviour - the latter suddenly become a "clique".

It appears to have blown up only today after relative peace and reasoned debate. Let's hope it's just a blip.

Quite.

[amateur51]

Ooh, good! Can we take that one up again? Seconds away...

[Beef Oven]

How sad, on returning after some time, to note that the unpleasantness is still going strong. From the same people, of course supported later by the same members of the clique.

Welcome back Simon. It is what it is and it ain't gonna change

[DavidP]

So you admit there is 'bait'. I would go further and state there is form, lots of it. On threads I have started, too. Given the repeated and pernicious nature of her posts to this effect, I feel that the world 'troll' is justified.

Of course, when others use sarcasm to make their point, as happens frequently enough here, it is the height of wit. Mine is deemed 'puerile'. Go figure. As always, the For3 clique of die-hard ex-BBC MB regulars rallies round to defend one of its own. And they wonder why few new people stay around to join in the debate.

In any case, I shall now cease to contribute further to this closed society.

You mean sarcasm of this kind, Thropple?

Another classic DavidP passive-aggressive Jekyll-and-Hyde moment. FF points out that they agree. DavidP seems surprised, happy. No, angry. Yes. Angry. Damn you all to hell! Gibber, gibber.

Matron, fetch the hypodermic!

The words, pot, kettle and black spring to mind!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

No you don't - what you do you see are threads where Lachenmann's music is described as pretentious nonsense, as garbage, as an example of Emperor's New Clothes Syndrome, & where anyone who appreciates Lachenmann's music is (a) either pretending to or (b) an example of the pernicious elitism that is destroying classical music.

Perhaps the heat is playing havoc with your memory?

Indeed; there were, IIRC, three negative posts about the Lachenmann piece before he-who-must-not-be-named came in with the ENC cliché - none of these received any rebuke, because they were expressions of the listeners' personal response. It was only when he-who-must-not-be-named chipped in with the suggestion that anyone who claimed to enjoy this Music were either gullible fools, or arrogant elitists set on stopping everybody else from listening to Mendelssohn that sparks began to fly.

[jean]

Oh dear. I try to be as balanced and pleasant as possible...

No, simon - you try to appear 'balanced and pleasant', while at the same time stirring as assiduously as you can.

(And nobody approached me by PM to persuade me to write that.)

[Simon]

No, simon - you try to appear 'balanced and pleasant', while at the same time stirring as assiduously as you can.

(And nobody approached me by PM to persuade me to write that.)

I'm sure there was no need, Jean. You are quite capable of making the post off your own bat.

But if you'd explain what can possibly be considered "stirring" by my earlier post, I'd be grateful. Then I wouldn't do it again.

Irrespective of your own views, I'm pleased to see that some other respected forum members were happy to engage with my comment and to take it in the positive spirit in which it was meant.

[jean]

But if you'd explain what can possibly be considered "stirring" by my earlier post, I'd be grateful. Then I wouldn't do it again.

All of it.

How sad, on returning after some time, to note that the unpleasantness is still going strong. From the same people, of course supported later by the same members of the clique.

[Barbirollians]

Indeed; there were, IIRC, three negative posts about the Lachenmann piece before he-who-must-not-be-named came in with the ENC cliché - none of these received any rebuke, because they were expressions of the listeners' personal response. It was only when he-who-must-not-be-named chipped in with the suggestion that anyone who claimed to enjoy this Music were either gullible fools, or arrogant elitists set on stopping everybody else from listening to Mendelssohn that sparks began to fly.

I love the fact that fhgl is now equating me with Lord Voldemort - does that make him Harry Potter with Arcades Project as Ron Weasley ?

Emperor's New Clothes was perfectly apt. A great deal of noise masquerading as music . As much as Caliban berated the Radio Times reviewer , they had it about right !

Only two classes of person I suggest would appreciate it - either those pretending to do so despite finding it impenetrable noise because it is thought to be the right thing to do or those whose musical knowledge and understanding might enable them to see the art or technical ability behind the noise.

That does not mean that class 1 - contains only gullible fools it also contains those who are worried that to admit they hate it would lead to Harry Potter and gang looking down on them and as for class 2 - I would never suggest that they would seek to prevent me from listening to Mendelssohm although their predecessors like Glock might have wished to - I envy them their knowledge but prefer the evidence of my ears