Margaret Thatcher dies

[Mr Pee]

Tough.

I removed amateur's 'Ding dong' thread title which, as everyone surely realises was a reference to 'Ding dong, the wicked witch is dead' and which offended her supporters. I removed RIP which offended her detractors. To complain that I replaced both with a plain title (neither overly respectful nor disrespectful) merely says you want to have it your way.

Amateur's "Ding Dong" jibe was clearly intended to be provocative, and was needlessly offensive.

BBM's simple RIP was nothing of the sort. If people are offended by such a simple, common expression of good wishes to the dead, then it says more about them than it does about the person expressing it, and I am quite sure that BBM, unlike amateur, had no wish to provoke or offend with that thread title.

That is the difference.

[Beef Oven]

There is no creator
and we are by nature more collaborative than competitive in my experience
it doesn't take a genius to encourage that side of humanity

Last week, in the 'Marxism for beginners' debates, I was told off for using personal experience by the armchair sociologists

[french frank]

ff do you think you can arrange for it that all my posts are displayed in the most desirable manner ? I suggest the top of every new page. I really don't think my posts and views get enough prominence. The fact they are haphazardly distibuted amongst the others seems deplorable.

I will investigate the software, eighth, to see if this can be achieved .

A final word on moderation, others may judge whether I was even-handed. I was perfectly happy for there to be two threads, as suggested (and I confess I personally found amateur's title the more offensive - for totally non-political reasons). When it became clear that both threads were becoming free-for-alls, there seemed little point if having two such threads dominating the What's New? list. I merged them, and as amateur posted his first, his title prevailed. I judged it provocative and selected the alternative RIP title. However, since the thread had amateur's post at the top, it appeared as if the title was his - and he objected. I replaced the title with a neutral one.

[Beef Oven]

Amateur's "Ding Dong" jibe was clearly intended to be provocative, and was needlessly offensive.

BBM's simple RIP was nothing of the sort. If people are offended by such a simple, common expression of good wishes to the dead, then it says more about them than it does about the person expressing it, and I am quite sure that BBM, unlike amateur, had no wish to provoke or offend with that thread title.

That is the difference.

Exactly Mr Pee.

[eighthobstruction]

Exactly Mr Pee.

....Not quite magic surely....more putting digit to keyboard via intellect.....

[Beef Oven]

....Not quite magic surely....more putting digit to keyboard via intellect.....

Yes, via intellect. Glad you're with us on this

[MrGongGong]

Last week, in the 'Marxism for beginners' debates, I was told off for using personal experience by the armchair sociologists

Surely there's "no such thing as sociologists" ?

[Richard Barrett]

(and if I might add Holger is not a "near" genius he is a complete god amongst men / women and the entire animal kingdom IMV)

Which Holger are you talking about, by the way? I think I must have missed something.

It seems to be hard to separate the anger that many of us still feel about the damage wreaked by Thatcher and her gang in the 1980s (and continued by her successors, of course) from the person herself. Objectively one can understand that it's acts and not people that are "evil". On a more personal level, however, I remember the daily sight and sound of Thatcher on the TV eventually made me feel physically sick, and they still do, and this is one moment when I'm most glad not to live in the UK any more, because I dare say that sight and sound have been much in evidence over the last couple of days.

[amateur51]

Amateur's "Ding Dong" jibe was clearly intended to be provocative, and was needlessly offensive.
.

It was not intended primarily to be offensive - it was a tribal call to all those who like me have had to deal with the fall-out, both personal and societal, of Thatcher's politics.

Interestingly there were spontaneous celebrations yesterday in North England and in London - in the North people were singing "Ding, Dong the Witch is Dead". This was pure coincidence.

I found BBM's title mildly offensive as it treats death as you might explain it to a child. Margaret Thatcher is not 'resting in peace' (with or withiout our support) - she is dead, like hundreds of elderly people who died yesterday.

However from what I know of BBM I cannot believe that he meant to be offensive.

[Sydney Grew]

Emily Lau, a former reporter and current legislator, recalled asking Mrs. Thatcher during her 1984 visit to Hong Kong whether it was morally defensible to deliver six million Hong Kong residents - most of them British - into the hands of a communist dictatorship. Mrs. Thatcher replied that she believed most Hong Kong people accepted the arrangement, and rudely and offensively suggested that Miss Lau was perhaps the "solitary exception."

This was perhaps Thatcher's lowest point, and demonstrates her fundamental inhumanity and racialism (of course the Falkland people are whites so they got treated differently). Regrettably she was by no means the only one in Britain to think in that way - and I judge that just as many do to-day. The only correct response of course would have been to invite to live in Britain as many of the people with British passports who wished to come. I for one would have welcomed that.

It is most interesting to read both here and in other forums about what a large number of intelligent Britons were actually stimulated to leave the country because of Thatcher and the rest of her loathsome régime. (I was one of that multitude.)

[MrGongGong]

Which Holger are you talking about, by the way? I think I must have missed something.

Holger Czukay

(nothing to do with Thatcher , but in the strange world that is the internet mR Beef must be the only Thatcher disciple who also has a complete set of Can, Crass, Test Department and Coil albums in his possession ...... which is mighty strange indeed )

[MrGongGong]

other forums about what a large number of intelligent Britons were actually stimulated to leave the country because of Thatcher and the rest of her loathsome régime. (I was one of that multitude.)

Sidney Sidney Sidney we never knew ....... cheers matey

[Richard Barrett]

Last week, in the 'Marxism for beginners' debates, I was told off for using personal experience by the armchair sociologists

In the "class" thread you went from dismissing everyone to engaging in the conversation with some really interesting insights, and now it's back to patronising talk of "Marxism for beginners" and "armchair sociologists." I wonder why you post here at all given that you clearly regard yourself as being surrounded by intellectual dwarves.

[eighthobstruction]

I think he finally went to the loft and brought down his meldewed degree notes....

[Richard Barrett]

Holger Czukay

... composer of one of the late twentieth century's great works of religious music, the track "Oh Lord Give Us More Money" from the Movies album. I though you might have meant the other genius Holger Hiller, whose oben im eck I was listening to the other day. If you don't know it I'm sure you'd like it.