The Dictatorship of the Etonariat

[sidneyfox]

It's a shame that so many of our "elected representatives" see themselves as delegates rather than representatives.

Objectively speaking, MPs are behaving very much as delegates, given that most sit in constituencies that most people voted to leave (the referendum vote mapped onto constituencies would give a landslide majority to leave, had it been a general election). If MPs acted according to their constituents’ wishes, the UK would have left a long time ago. MPs and the parliament are doing their own thing.

[CGR]

You're right Mr GongGong. CGR may either be someone very silly, or actually one of Mr Putin's bots - those computer-generated things that sow discord on Facebook and other places. It's fascinating to observe how effective it is: witness the rather more personal attacks that have appeared on this thread since its intervention. Better for all to simply avoid commenting on whatever it comes up with. When I taught in primary schools I was forever telling the children to avoid being upset by the silly ones and that the best remedy was to walk away. If you are real GCR, God bless you and may you have a little think before you post.

Oh dear. So now we have the 'anyone who dares express an opinion opposed to my opinion is a Russian bot' argument. How pathetic.

[ahinton]

True, and the accusation of racism is thrown about so much these days that it’s almost lost it’s meaning. Although Boris seems to be a rather unsavoury character. But is he that out of kilter with most of the rest of parliament and its appalling behaviour? British politics, it’s procedures, statesmen and decisions were once looked upon as the gold standard on how to govern. IMHO, we are now a laughing stock.

No, I don't think that he is all that much out of kilter with some of the rest of Parliament; that is hardly a recommendation.

[ahinton]

Objectively speaking, MPs are behaving very much as delegates, given that most sit in constituencies that most people voted to leave (the referendum vote mapped onto constituencies would give a landslide majority to leave, had it been a general election). If MPs acted according to their constituents’ wishes, the UK would have left a long time ago. MPs and the parliament are doing their own thing.

So Scotland and London would have left UK by now, then?...

[ahinton]

Oh dear. So now we have the 'anyone who dares express an opinion opposed to my opinion is a Russian bot' argument. How pathetic.

I for one would not accuse anyone of that - not that this encourages me to concur with most of what you write...

[MrGongGong]

Objectively speaking, MPs are behaving very much as delegates, given that most sit in constituencies that most people voted to leave (the referendum vote mapped onto constituencies would give a landslide majority to leave, had it been a general election). If MPs acted according to their constituents’ wishes, the UK would have left a long time ago. MPs and the parliament are doing their own thing.

That's simply not the case
The vast majority of them still insist that they have to "respect the result" when, if they were really acting as representatives and representing our best interests they would scrap the whole thing...

[sidneyfox]

That's simply not the case
The vast majority of them still insist that they have to "respect the result" when, if they were really acting as representatives and representing our best interests they would scrap the whole thing...

It’s not about ‘respecting the referendum’. And there should be no reluctance - they (parliament) overwhelmingly passed a bill to hold a referendum on whether the UK should remain in the EU. Following the referendum parliament then took the decision to act on the result and with the biggest democratic mandate in our history they passed an act of parliament for our withdrawal. So they must ‘respect the result’ mustn’t they? There is absolutely no mandate whatsoever for remaining in the EU, nor is there any mandate to change the remain/leave option to include the proviso of a deal.

[Conchis]

I think arguments about ‘democracy’ are irrelevant. What the events of the last three years has proved, beyond a shadow of a doubt, is that Brexit is undeliverable.

There is no crisis in the country, only a crisis among the political class, whose bluff was called. It would only be right and proper if the real casualty of that crisis was the Conservative Party.

[Beresford]

It’s not about ‘respecting the referendum’. And there should be no reluctance - they (parliament) overwhelmingly passed a bill to hold a referendum on whether the UK should remain in the EU. Following the referendum parliament then took the decision to act on the result and with the biggest democratic mandate in our history they passed an act of parliament for our withdrawal. So they must ‘respect the result’ mustn’t they? There is absolutely no mandate whatsoever for remaining in the EU, nor is there any mandate to change the remain/leave option to include the proviso of a deal.

The referendum is NOT a mandate - it is advisory under law. Just as the "Will of the People" is in truth the "Wish of 37% of the people in 2016".

[Bryn]

It’s not about ‘respecting the referendum’. And there should be no reluctance - they (parliament) overwhelmingly passed a bill to hold a referendum on whether the UK should remain in the EU. Following the referendum parliament then took the decision to act on the result and with the biggest democratic mandate in our history they passed an act of parliament for our withdrawal. So they must ‘respect the result’ mustn’t they? There is absolutely no mandate whatsoever for remaining in the EU, nor is there any mandate to change the remain/leave option to include the proviso of a deal.

Respecting the result of a referendum held under U.K. constitutional conditions and treating that result as a diktat are two different things. In this state, referendums are, constitutionally, advisory. It is up to the parliamentary representatives to decide the way in which to apply respect to the result.

[Bryn]

The referendum is NOT a mandate - it is advisory under law. Just as the "Will of the People" is in truth the "Wish of 37% of the people"

Not quite. It is, rather, a measure of the wish of around 27% of the people. It indicated the wish of around 37% of those entitled to vote.

[Dave2002]

Objectively speaking, MPs are behaving very much as delegates, given that most sit in constituencies that most people voted to leave (the referendum vote mapped onto constituencies would give a landslide majority to leave, had it been a general election). If MPs acted according to their constituents’ wishes, the UK would have left a long time ago. MPs and the parliament are doing their own thing.

My MP has not acted according to his constituents wishes. This constituency voted to Remain. There are others surely.

I agree that over the whole country there is or was a move in favour of Leave, but so far that has not been seen to be possible, for some really quite sensible reasons.

In terms of what people want, I suspect despite all the anger, shenanigans etc., that leaving the EU is really rather low down on most people's priorities. The whole debacle has been a disaster in terms of distracting the MPs and civil servants away from really running the country.

I am not strongly attached to either view, but things do have to be done in ways which won't make our lives substantially worse, both in the short term, and in the longer term.

[CGR]

Respecting the result of a referendum held under U.K. constitutional conditions and treating that result as a diktat are two different things. In this state, referendums are, constitutionally, advisory. It is up to the parliamentary representatives to decide the way in which to apply respect to the result.

Referendum leaflet: "This is your decision. The Government will implement what you decide."

Labour Manifesto 2017: "Labour accepts the referendum result ..."

Politicians - Liars, traitors and charlatans

[sidneyfox]

The referendum is NOT a mandate - it is advisory under law. Just as the "Will of the People" is in truth the "Wish of 37% of the people in 2016".

The referendum is indeed a mandate. Parliament told us so. Having considered the outcome of the advisory referendum, they decided to act on it as a mandate of the people and enacted legislation for our withdrawal from the EU. You might be confusing mandate with mandatory.

[sidneyfox]

Not quite. It is, rather, a measure of the wish of around 27% of the people. It indicated the wish of around 37% of those entitled to vote.

Stay at homes cant be included in this - your figures are therefore spurious. It’s pure and simple, most people who were entitled to vote and went to the polling station, voted to leave. 54%. Most people who voted in the referendum voted to leave.

The fact that you wanted a different outcome is another conversation altogether.