The Dictatorship of the Etonariat

[Serial_Apologist]

I was born in the year of Suez, but I confess my memory of it is slight. The current situation is like riding a roller coaster without knowing if it's been finished or not. I don't know how it's going to all end, but my suspicion is that it won't be well.

The SC ruling suggests Corbyn's strategy on Brexit could be right. Be that as may, most of the opposition parties find themselves more in agreement for a second referendum now, general election or no general election.

[Richard Barrett]

The SC ruling suggests Corbyn's strategy on Brexit could be right. Be that as may, most of the opposition parties find themselves more in agreement for a second referendum now, general election or no general election.

That does leave the LibDems somewhat out in the cold, doesn't it? What I find difficult to get my head round is that so many Remain-minded people seem more enthusiastic about the LDs' policy of ditching Brexit immediately (unless they go into coalition with the Tories in which case they'd probably shelve it in favour of getting shafted again on the question of proportional representation) than about a second referendum - if they're so convinced of the rightness of their cause, of not having the result skewed by lies and obfuscation from the Leave side, and of all those new voters helping to swing the result, what is there to be afraid of?

[Bryn]

It will be interesting to see/hear how Johnson's speech to the UN General Assembly is received.

[vinteuil]

.

... my immediate delight is tempered by my fear that this will just feed in to the underlying Cummings/Johnson narrative of a 'people versus the Establishment' battle, in which the OE Johnson implausibly plays the part of the brave fighter for the little people...

.

[John Locke]

That does leave the LibDems somewhat out in the cold, doesn't it? What I find difficult to get my head round is that so many Remain-minded people seem more enthusiastic about the LDs' policy of ditching Brexit immediately (unless they go into coalition with the Tories in which case they'd probably shelve it in favour of getting shafted again on the question of proportional representation) than about a second referendum - if they're so convinced of the rightness of their cause, of not having the result skewed by lies and obfuscation from the Leave side, and of all those new voters helping to swing the result, what is there to be afraid of?

Others think that this strategy to 'please Remainers and Leavers' will end up pleasing neither side. And how can you have the chair of the meeting thinking a vote on a show of hands had been passed, and then having her mind changed by the person sitting next to her looking at the same auditorium? and no card count?

[Bryn]

. . . how can you have the chair of the meeting thinking a vote on a show of hands had been passed, and then having her mind changed by the person sitting next to her looking at the same auditorium? and no card count?

Indeed, but nothing very unusual in party conference voting, whichever party's conference is involved.

[Pulcinella]

That does leave the LibDems somewhat out in the cold, doesn't it? What I find difficult to get my head round is that so many Remain-minded people seem more enthusiastic about the LDs' policy of ditching Brexit immediately (unless they go into coalition with the Tories in which case they'd probably shelve it in favour of getting shafted again on the question of proportional representation) than about a second referendum - if they're so convinced of the rightness of their cause, of not having the result skewed by lies and obfuscation from the Leave side, and of all those new voters helping to swing the result, what is there to be afraid of?

A real problem for voters in York Outer, wanting to get rid of the sitting Tory, if/when the next election comes.
In 2017 there was a pact between Labour and Lib Dem voters in York Inner and York Outer to try to oust Sturdy. Labour got pretty close, and Luke, the candidate (who happened to live a few doors away), was justifiably pleased. I'm not sure that such an arrangement would satisfy voters (including me!) next time, not least because I'm not sure that I can support either Labour or Lib Dem policy. We are, however, doing our bit by encouraging students to register: many of them think they live in York Inner but they may well be in York Outer!

General election 2017: York Outer
Party Candidate Votes %
Conservative Julian Sturdy 29,356 51.1
Labour Luke Charters-Reid 21,067 36.7
Liberal Democrat James Blanchard 5,910 10.3
Green Bethan Vincent 1,094 1.9
Majority 8,289 14.4
Turnout 57,427 75.7
Conservative hold

PS: Not sure of the logic of the pact now! I think Lib Dems in York Inner agreed to vote Labour (to support the sitting MP) in exchange for Labour voters in York Outer voting Lib Dem, thinking that they stood the better chance of ousting Sturdy. In that case, it didn't really work (though Luke still did well!).

[Richard Barrett]

Others think that this strategy to 'please Remainers and Leavers' will end up pleasing neither side.

Indeed. The pressure is now on to persuade enough of them that this is the right way to go.

And how can you have the chair of the meeting thinking a vote on a show of hands had been passed, and then having her mind changed by the person sitting next to her looking at the same auditorium? and no card count?

A very good question.

[jayne lee wilson]

WOW!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/politics

This is just massive.... true democracy still - just - functioning......

[johnb]

Why does the state of our politics and political parties bring to mind a rather outlandish pastiche of a Gilbert & Sullivan operetta?

[gurnemanz]

You've heard the judgement. Get the T-Shirt

[Bryn]

You've heard the judgement. Get the T-Shirt

Not an accurate representation of the arachnid in question.

[Bryn]

JC just shot himself in the foot. How can someone in that position not know the difference between unlawful and illegal? Sure, someone else may have written the speech but he should have spotted the error and not recited it.

[Pulcinella]

JC just shot himself in the foot. How can someone in that position not know the difference between unlawful and illegal? Sure, someone else may have written the speech but he should have spotted the error and not recited it.

Black's Law Dictionary defines unlawful as "not authorized by law, illegal." Illegal is defined as "forbidden by law, unlawful." Semantically, there is a slight difference. It seems that something illegal is expressly proscribed by statute, and something unlawful is just not expressly authorized.
Jaywalking is a good example of an unlawful act. Traffic regulations do not typically say that you cannot walk diagonally through an intersection. So, it is not illegal. Rather, traffic regulations typically provide that you can cross within a crosswalk when the little walky-man appears. Crossing in any other way is unlawful because it is not expressly permitted.

Extracted from here:

https://www.thestreet.com/story/10376739/1/unlawful-vs-illegal.html

[Bryn]

Black's Law Dictionary defines unlawful as "not authorized by law, illegal." Illegal is defined as "forbidden by law, unlawful." Semantically, there is a slight difference. It seems that something illegal is expressly proscribed by statute, and something unlawful is just not expressly authorized.
Jaywalking is a good example of an unlawful act. Traffic regulations do not typically say that you cannot walk diagonally through an intersection. So, it is not illegal. Rather, traffic regulations typically provide that you can cross within a crosswalk when the little walky-man appears. Crossing in any other way is unlawful because it is not expressly permitted.

Indeed, it is a fairly fine difference, but a lawmaker with the years of experience that JC has should know, and be wary of, that difference. The Supreme Court's judgement specifically described Johnson's actions as unlawful. Given their advanced legal standing, that would not have been without due consideration.