Originally posted by Richard Barrett
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The Dictatorship of the Etonariat
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Originally posted by Stunsworth View PostWell, I'd agree that there's a sense of hopelessness (in this person at least). Things are happening that we appear to have no control over. What's now being offered will have severe consequences for the part of the UK I live in, bears no relationship to what was offered before the referendum, and there's nothing anyone appears to be able to do about it.
Sheep farmers - the main industry apart from tourism - here once voted 'leave', but are now VERY far from sure that was the right decision. INdeed, many have said they feel betrayed. Betrayed by what I leave you to suggest.
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the impression I get is that most people on this forum are basically liberal with small if not a large L and their contributions on here evince the limitations of the liberal mindset: a belief that if we play fair, our opponents, impressed by the example we set, will play fair, too.
And if that makes me an ineffectual and indecisive waste of space then so be it - heaven knows it's a charge I level at myself often enough - but a liberal? I'm not convinced.
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Originally posted by oddoneout View PostIf someone felt it necessary to pigeonhole me politically then I imagine 'liberal' would be the slot chosen. However it has nothing to do with expecting others to play fair, but rather trying to live in a way I think right. From the very earliest childhood I was told, often forcefully, that 'two wrongs don't make a right', and it stuck. The fact that within my family my siblings often didn't take any notice of that principle, and didn't play fair, taught me not to have expectations of others' behaviour - but the basic idea seemed to me to be a good one and so I stuck with it. No doubt if I didn't also have the unfortunate wish to try and see more than one side of an issue life would have been somewhat easier - I can certainly see the attraction of aligning with particular political, or indeed religious, tribes.
And if that makes me an ineffectual and indecisive waste of space then so be it - heaven knows it's a charge I level at myself often enough - but a liberal? I'm not convinced.
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Originally posted by Conchis View PostI know you’re not a liberal (and I’m CERTAINLY not) but the impression I get is that most people on this forum are basically liberal with small if not a large L ...
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What Britain needs is a left-wing government that will not shirk from deploying right wing methods: I’m afraid that does actually mean slitting peoples’ throats rather than attempting to ‘persuade’ them. Surely we’ve realised by now that some people (and you can see these bovine numbskulls interviewed on the vox pop segments on tv) are beyond persuasion?
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If the eventual 'solution' is Napoleon, I'm not sure we're getting far...
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Originally posted by DracoM View PostSheep farmers - the main industry apart from tourism - here once voted 'leave', but are now VERY far from sure that was the right decision. INdeed, many have said they feel betrayed. Betrayed by what I leave you to suggest.Steve
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It’s all thoroughly dispiriting, whichever side of the argument one is on (and there’s plenty to be said about that, of course). My biggest fear is that having come to this point of a hollowing out from the uneasy balance that’s been more or less in place for my whole life, the remainder of it will be irrevocably blighted, with little or no prospect of any sort of equilibrium returning. And I don’t like that feeling one little bit. History suggests that the sort of polarity which has arisen in recent years plays out painfully and destructively for everyone.
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Originally posted by DracoM View PostUtterly agree.
Sheep farmers - the main industry apart from tourism - here once voted 'leave', but are now VERY far from sure that was the right decision. INdeed, many have said they feel betrayed. Betrayed by what I leave you to suggest.
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Originally posted by DracoM View PostBehind this wildness is a shadowy, unelected fanatic, expert at manipulating narcissists.
You may be thinking I am talking about John Bolton pulling Trump's strings.
But look at Westminster, and you will see another such.
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Originally posted by DracoM View PostBehind this wildness is a shadowy, unelected fanatic, expert at manipulating narcissists.
You may be thinking I am talking about John Bolton pulling Trump's strings.
But look at Westminster, and you will see another such.
....Hoping this isn't just an Establishment ruse to blind /startle/and false trail folk into an Election with deflected information, glittering gifts and Red Top coverage igniting Xenaphobia (+ false WW2 syndrome in ignorant folk who were never there but were football holigans at Euro 2000) ....this little interlude has debased deception written all over it...."perfidious"...
....keep it clean - keep it going....bong ching
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Originally posted by muzzer View PostIt’s all thoroughly dispiriting, whichever side of the argument one is on (and there’s plenty to be said about that, of course). My biggest fear is that having come to this point of a hollowing out from the uneasy balance that’s been more or less in place for my whole life, the remainder of it will be irrevocably blighted, with little or no prospect of any sort of equilibrium returning. And I don’t like that feeling one little bit. History suggests that the sort of polarity which has arisen in recent years plays out painfully and destructively for everyone.bong ching
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But it really isn't necessary to view "polarisation" as an inherently bad thing, when in fact positive changes in society, like the abolition of slavery, votes for women, workers' rights and so on have all come about as a result of "polarisation" around these issues. What we are seeing now, as a result of the processes that led to the Brexit vote, is a laying bare of the class structure of British society, which the Johnsons and Camerons of the country (if not the Moggs) have generally tried to paper over in the interests of retaining their position of power and making the situation look "democratic". As soon as that position is seriously under threat their true colours begin to show.
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