Chomsky on Trump

[Beef Oven!]

.........not least to the politicians both serving and ex, who do their bidding.

Actually no, they get the least jobs. The masses get most jobs.

[Serial_Apologist]

Actually no, they get the least jobs. The masses get most jobs.

Which reminds one of the argument which always used to be used against advocates of re-distribution: namely that taxing the rich to bring their conjoint income and wealth down to nearer that of the majority would merely impoverish the rich while hardly making any material difference for the rest.

[french frank]

Indeed. But we were talking about the 'clout' governments do or do not have in the matter of where those jobs might be.

That too. Like what 'clout' they have to persuade a company like Nissan to provide jobs in Sunderland, if so minded. There are 'understandings'.

[jean]

That's not 'clout', it's bribery born of desperation!

[Serial_Apologist]

That's not 'clout', it's bribery born of desperation!

Exactly!

[Conchis]

Is anyone looking forward to the Trump Presidency?

In a perverse way, I am. Trump has strong entertainment value (or he did have when he was on the campaign trail) and though no-one will sleep easy in their beds while he occupies the Oval Office (only I hear he's not really going to occupy it), it might be interesting for observers. Lots of skeletons ready to fall out of lots of closets, Trump's trumping business interests ripe for conflict with his administrative ones and a wall to build and lots of unhappy people if it isn't built.

The next four years could be interesting - if we make it through them! Anyone think there's any danger of Trump being a 'dull' President?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I just hope that he will disappoint his admirers/supporters as much as Obama has disappointed his.

[vinteuil]

I just hope that he will disappoint his admirers/supporters as much as Obama has disappointed his.

... my fear is that that disappointment will produce some pretty ugly things.

[Padraig]

... my fear is that that disappointment will produce some pretty ugly things.

Whilst I share that fear, I still admire President Obama as a man and for his efforts.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Whilst I share that fear, I still admire President Obama as a man and for his efforts.

- on both counts.

[french frank]

That's not 'clout', it's bribery born of desperation!

Isn't that why we put the word in quotes? Clout and bribery come to the same thing if it means they get what they want, when they want it.

[ahinton]

Is anyone looking forward to the Trump Presidency?

If it happens (which, short of any number of possible impeachments, it almost certainly will), I'd rather look backward to it and the sooner the better.

[Beef Oven!]

Is anyone looking forward to the Trump Presidency?

I wouldn’t say I’m looking forward to it, but he might turn out to be a 'good president’.

Our fears and concerns might have more to do with our belief system than what might actually happen - a bit like the idea of him being elected was treated as joke by us, initially. Perhaps reality isn't as closely related to our world view as we think.

[ahinton]

I wouldn’t say I’m looking forward to it, but he might turn out to be a 'good president’.

Our fears and concerns might have more to do with our belief system than what might actually happen - a bit like the idea of him being elected was treated as joke by us, initially. Perhaps reality isn't as closely related to our world view as we think.

A "good President" for whom and on what grounds? What might define a "good President"?

Whilst I take the remainder of your points, I rather think that it's at least as likely that a substantial number of people's fears about the Trump Presidency (should it come about) are founded principally upon the sheer uncertainty surrounding what he and his henchpersons might or might not do once he's in office rather than the actions themselves (whatever they might be); in this, as with so much else, it parallels the Brexit business in which, at least for the foreseeable future (to the extent that the future is foreseeable!), many people's concerns relate more to such uncertainty as to what might be attempted and when than to what the outcomes of such attempts might turn out to be. In other words, it's as much if not more a case of fear engendered by not knowing what those in charge might or might not do rather than one predicated upon particular decisions to take specific actions.

I'm not so certain that many people treated the prospect of a Trump electoral success as a "joke" as much as an improbability; I rather think that some people regarded (and indeed still do regard) Trump himself, rather than the prospect of his being elected as President of the not remotely "free" world, as a "joke". I also think that, the way things are going, the very term "world view" is on a dangerous trajectory towards a redundancy born of ever increasing meaninglessness.

[Serial_Apologist]

A "good President" for whom and on what grounds? What might define a "good President"?

Whilst I take the remainder of your points, I rather think that it's at least as likely that a substantial number of people's fears about the Trump Presidency (should it come about) are founded principally upon the sheer uncertainty surrounding what he and his henchpersons might or might not do once he's in office rather than the actions themselves (whatever they might be)

In connection with which, it's interesting to observe the anticipatory obsequiousness observed in reportage of Trump's sidepersons as having a positive effect on his purportive change of mind on a number of his scarier pre-election promises, while noting the differences in our mainstream journalist's assessment of Corbyn, in the way the latter deliberately overlooks the fact that in the British example on offer leadership always involves more than one person, whereas in the States it puts people in places where they can indiscriminately order other people around, and there's apparently nothing they can do about it. Note especially the differences between the transparent defensiveness betrayed by Trump's apologists whenever interviewed and asked to justify their uncritical support, and the outspokenness of Labour Party members in criticising Corbyn.