Westminster Abbey on BBC2

[Simon]

What a fascinating thread. Many very strongly held views are being expressed under the auspices of an "independent forum for Radio 3 listeners" and the sub-forum "The Choir". I wonder which programmes on Radio 3 are the regular fare of Calum, Simon and Mr GongGong?

That's what happens sometimes, Chitreb! Though not as often on the Choir section as elesewhere.

Edit: if you look back you'll see that it was Calum's post that introduced the political slant, which is normal for him. But he doesn't usually venture here, and his posts are generally worth reading wherever he makes them, whether you agree with them or not. (Unlike those of one or two others, who simply try to cause trouble, and you'll soon suss them out. The other main culprit is banned from this section.)

As for R3, it was me who began the regular CE threads years ago, on the old BBC boards, and CE is the one I try not to miss, along with the Sunday evening programmes that follow the repeat. But I listen when I can to other R3 programmes, especially choral and early music slots. I expect that my listening is roughly 50% R3, 30% R4, 10% Classic fm and 10% BBC local radio.

Glad you've joined us, though. Always good to read new views.

[Alison]

For my money its a good team at Wabbey just now. The Dean seems a very nice chap and above all a man of faith.

James O'Donnell has brought the choir to a very high standard indeed, easily surpassing the inconsequential tenure
of 'dreary Neary'. A shame organist Robert Quinney is leaving but he will be a tremendous asset to Peterborough.

And then there's the fabulously intelligent Dr James Hawkey, Minor Canon, who will feature tonight. A bright star who will surely
rise to the very top of the Anglican church.

[ardcarp]

I must quibble slightly about the 'dreary Neary' soubriquet. I don't think anyone (Preston, O'Donnell) quite reached the same heights as in their previous places. Maybe this is something to do with Wabbey. I don't know. But Neary achieved a very fine standard at Winchester. I attended a couple of SCFs when he was at the helm and was mightily impressed. Yes, Wabbey is OK now, but are they really reaching the heights achiebved by O'Donnell in some of his Drome CDs? Personally I think Neary got the Abbey Choir sounding as good as it's ever been. Whether people liked him or not is a different question. One doesn't necessarily achieve the best results from a choir or an orchestra by just being a nice bloke.

Apropos of nothing, I went to a lovely recital given by Alice Neary last week. She (and her pianist) played the Debussy cello sonata better than I've ever heard it. She is, IMO a world class musician.

[DracoM]

Well, sadly, Alison, I have to disagree.

I think JO'D has not had all that a distinguished run at Wabbey - heard them several times over the last year, and they always seemed just that wee bit rushed or maybe under-rehearsed. Now that might be just an unfortunate coincidence, but........His work at the Drome made THAT choir even more of an outstanding singing place. Maybe there are just too many gigs at irregular intervals and then in rushes which always means that he is behind the game and not controlling it or the choir's training schedule as you might with a choir with fewer of the stratospherically high profile services at Wabbey, many of which are seen / beamed globally? He's a fab musician and choir trainer, no doubt, but it doesn't always come across that this choir is singing for him as the Drome team did.

[Alison]

Perhaps it's not quite fair to compare studio made CD's with routine Abbey gigs.

I'm sure the hectic schedules are an issue. And then lots of the chaps go off on tours with other choirs etc
and consistency becomes an issue.

Yes, bit mean of me to drag up that soubriquet again.

[BBMmk2]

The preograsmme is running rather well, imo. I would love to go there soon!

[EdgeleyRob]

The preograsmme is running rather well,

OOOOO matron

[DracoM]

Well, his praises were sung earlier on this thread, but when it came to far too long footage and coverage of the whole upper crust fuss about that Minor Canon and his MARRIAGE, the sequence showed off to great effect the sleek, moneyed gloss, and cosy elitist air of unmistakable exclusivity and privilege that has so far permeated this series. Ascot at Prayer. With music.

The choir / music team is unarguably the sanest, and hardest working unit on show. Fascinating sequence with the Sistine Chapel Choir [ erm...fat kids??] and the Wabbey choir together. As for the rest - sorry, but this is doing Wabbey's image no good at all - well, not in my eyes. It will of course be wonderful for lavish fund raising dinners in USA - did you get the tone of the PR woman targeting her Rome tweets to the US? You rather feel that this is a very major point of the series, so we've had the William / Kate marriage nudged at us in every prog so far just to remind us, plus as 'walk-on extras' the Dalai Lama and the Pope. Not bad casting, eh? And in and round it all, milling plebs, many shelling out the best part of £50 to get in for two adults and two kids, and none allowed to take photos - why not? A once in a life time visit for most? Hmm.

[MrGongGong]

What a fascinating thread. Many very strongly held views are being expressed under the auspices of an "independent forum for Radio 3 listeners" and the sub-forum "The Choir". I wonder which programmes on Radio 3 are the regular fare of Calum, Simon and Mr GongGong?

Well

Hear and Now, Late Junction, occasional concerts and odd other stuff
and I try to catch things by people I know ........

[Alison]

Too cynical Dracs.

Don't suppose many of 'em are on high salaries.

[Gabriel Jackson]

Well, sadly, Alison, I have to disagree.

I think JO'D has not had all that a distinguished run at Wabbey - heard them several times over the last year, and they always seemed just that wee bit rushed or maybe under-rehearsed. Now that might be just an unfortunate coincidence, but........His work at the Drome made THAT choir even more of an outstanding singing place. Maybe there are just too many gigs at irregular intervals and then in rushes which always means that he is behind the game and not controlling it or the choir's training schedule as you might with a choir with fewer of the stratospherically high profile services at Wabbey, many of which are seen / beamed globally? He's a fab musician and choir trainer, no doubt, but it doesn't always come across that this choir is singing for him as the Drome team did.

You haven't got a clue have you?!

[teamsaint]

Well, his praises were sung earlier on this thread, but when it came to far too long footage and coverage of the whole upper crust fuss about that Minor Canon and his MARRIAGE, the sequence showed off to great effect the sleek, moneyed gloss, and cosy elitist air of unmistakable exclusivity and privilege that has so far permeated this series. Ascot at Prayer. With music.

The choir / music team is unarguably the sanest, and hardest working unit on show. Fascinating sequence with the Sistine Chapel Choir [ erm...fat kids??] and the Wabbey choir together. As for the rest - sorry, but this is doing Wabbey's image no good at all - well, not in my eyes. It will of course be wonderful for lavish fund raising dinners in USA - did you get the tone of the PR woman targeting her Rome tweets to the US? You rather feel that this is a very major point of the series, so we've had the William / Kate marriage nudged at us in every prog so far just to remind us, plus as 'walk-on extras' the Dalai Lama and the Pope. Not bad casting, eh? And in and round it all, milling plebs, many shelling out the best part of £50 to get in for two adults and two kids, and none allowed to take photos - why not? A once in a life time visit for most? Hmm.

pretty much agree Dracs. Its £16 each to get in..... to see your own "centre of national life". Built by our own ancestors with their hard labour .

We must need our heads testing to allow this sort of thing to go on.

[BBMmk2]

Like they said in the programme, ts, they have to get this money from somewhere.And I think it's a good idea. St paul's Cathedral is£2 cheaper.

[teamsaint]

Like they said in the programme, ts, they have to get this money from somewhere.And I think it's a good idea. St paul's Cathedral is£2 cheaper.

people who are against this kind of charge are aware that money has to come from somewhere.
it could come from government.for people to be able to visit this Centre of National Life , for free, would costs absolute peanuts in national government spend terms. I think it is a deception to say that the Abbey is such a focus of national life, (but if you want a quick butch that will be £16 )
I know for a fact that lots of people are put off visiting our great cathedrals by high admission charges, and that is just wrong IMO.

[MrGongGong]

I think it is a deception to say that the Abbey is such a focus of national life,

Indeed

Personally I have no objection to paying to visit cathedrals, I don't believe in the god stuff so it has cultural rather than religious significance and if the church really believed in what they purport to they would sell the lot and use the money to do "good works", so there is a benefit to us all that most of those in the church (and NOT all of them) are only pretending to do what their religion says.