Nine Lessons and Carols 24th Dec 2011 [R4 4 live ] 25th Dec [R3 / 2 p.m. ]

[ardcarp]

I listened to the service in the company of an ex-Kings choral scholar. Our unanimous thoughts about the soloist in the 3 Kings was that he was just trying too hard; and if he goes on like that, what's his voice going to sound like when he is 40? Doucement, doucement.
There seemed to be a desperate urgency about the service in general. The 9th lesson was positively bellowed.

[Petrushka]

Probably not, VodkaDilc. The part that always gets to me in the Willcocks version is the BFAD chord on "Word" in the final verse. I've sung the Willcocks versions of "O come" and "Hark" ever since I sang the descants (not long after C for C One was first published), and without them my Christmas would not be complete!

Same here! I recall us having brand new copies of C for C one in our Parish Church choir (1965?) and that splendid chord on 'Word' used to send a real shiver down my spine. The Willcocks descants are simply wonderful and a joy to sing.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

The part that always gets to me in the Willcocks version is the BFAD chord on "Word" in the final verse.

I couldn't agree more, and what a moment to modulate to the supertonic minor!
The irony is that the worse-than-mediocre Cleobury descants have been sung at this service many more times than the Willcocks ones ever were, yet no amount of repetition made them acceptable, whereas Ledger's did grow on me after a while.
If I'm not mistaken, Cleobury wrote new (and perhaps better) ones for the 2010 service at King's.

[subcontrabass]

I thought that Cleobury's descants were verging into self-parody - it was wonderful to hear the Willcocks versions in the last two hymns. Is there a more moving descant than the Willcocks penultimate verse of O come all ye faithful?

I heard nothing to take exception to in Cleobury's descants. They were a refreshing change from corn and cliche.

[morebritishmusicplease]

Well, I must say that the Tansy Davies was one of the most turgid, dreary and utterly un-carol-like offerings I have heard for a long time! And far too long, as others have pointed out (royalty payments for broadcast payments are based on duration, you know). To think she was actually commissioned and paid for that stuff - it was so hideous, for a minute I thought it was Michael Finnissy! lol

[Magnificat]

I must say that I thought the TV service particularly beautifully sung.

I could have listened to those boys all night long. None of that awful rough and raucous tone we get from a lot of choirs these days and which grates so much on the ears. The King's sound does not always travel well but on their home ground they can be superb and I thought they were this year.

Straightforward selection of carols and arrangements,and none the worse for that, but "Blessed be That Maid Mary" was new to me and I thought it absolutely lovely.

Somewhere up - thread someone said that should the post of DoM of Music at King's become vacant potential applicants should think twice about applying. The job is probably not as attractive these days what with the weight of renown that hangs so heavily on the DoM and the difficulties with the social engineering of university admissions looming over the recruitment of choral scholars etc. But what self - respecting choir trainer would not want to create a choir that is worthy to grace that incomparable building?

VCC

[mercia]

the worse-than-mediocre Cleobury descants have been sung at this service many more times than the Willcocks ones ever were

is that not simply because SC has been incumbent far longer than Sir David was

I think the most effective descants are where the "arranger" has dared (or been able) to change the underlying harmony

[ardcarp]

I think the most effective descants are where the "arranger" has dared (or been able) to change the underlying
harmony

Definitely.

[Mr Pee]

I wasn't keen on the version of "Silent Night" that was sung on the TV broadcast. The beauty of that carol is its simplicity, and for me the arrangement was far too fussy. As the saying goes, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!".

And they didn't sing my favourite carol of all- "In the Bleak Midwinter".

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

is that not simply because SC has been incumbent far longer than Sir David was

Yes, but my point was (though I didn't state it) that despite the longevity of the Cleobury descants, they were never taken up elsewhere. Yet the Ledger descants were orchestrated for the CBSO Carol Concerts and were broadcast.

[paradisum]

silent night

For my money, far and away the best arrangement of Silent Night is Andrew Lumsden's, sung at Winchester Cathedral. Sadly it's not published but here is a link to a recent bbc performance:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRZOv31n1sY

[Caussade]

I must say that I thought the TV service particularly beautifully sung.

I could have listened to those boys all night long. None of that awful rough and raucous tone we get from a lot of choirs these days and which grates so much on the ears. The King's sound does not always travel well but on their home ground they can be superb and I thought they were this year.

Straightforward selection of carols and arrangements,and none the worse for that, but "Blessed be That Maid Mary" was new to me and I thought it absolutely lovely.

Somewhere up - thread someone said that should the post of DoM of Music at King's become vacant potential applicants should think twice about applying. The job is probably not as attractive these days what with the weight of renown that hangs so heavily on the DoM and the difficulties with the social engineering of university admissions looming over the recruitment of choral scholars etc. But what self - respecting choir trainer would not want to create a choir that is worthy to grace that incomparable building?

VCC

Care to give us some instances (not ones the 'Daily Mail' has invented) where you think 'social engineering', rather than the application of strict academic criteria, has influenced university admissions, VCC? Or are you making it up, as usual?

[pole_2_pole]

For my money, far and away the best arrangement of Silent Night is Andrew Lumsden's, sung at Winchester Cathedral. Sadly it's not published but here is a link to a recent bbc performance:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRZOv31n1sY

It's published by Encore...

[Magnificat]

Care to give us some instances (not ones the 'Daily Mail' has invented) where you think 'social engineering', rather than the application of strict academic criteria, has influenced university admissions, VCC? Or are you making it up, as usual?

Caussade,

Surely you are aware of the current political pressure, on Oxbridge to admit less advantaged students from State schools with lower grades than those from private schools. Whether this is desirable or not it is social engineering by any definition and is bound to have an impact on the supply of singers to the colleges since it is the independent schools, unfortunately, which still provide the bulk of choral scholars to the colleges and will make things even more difficult for DoMs than the application of strict academic criteria to admissions already does.

Personally I do think that a University should consider not just academic qualifications but the skills that students from any background can offer to the colleges be they artistic, sporting or whatever, as that is what a University should be about not just the utilitarian business of examination grades.

VCC.

[Vile Consort]

Caussade,
Personally I do think that a University should consider not just academic qualifications but the skills that students from any background can offer to the colleges be they artistic, sporting or whatever, as that is what a University should be about not just the utilitarian business of examination grades.

VCC.

The students at Cambridge are expected to be able to keep up with the ferocious pace of the teaching. It is in nobody's interest, least of all the students', to admit candidates who then fail their exams or have a nervous breakdown because the work is too much for them. It certainly isn't in the interests of those students who might have got in and been able to cope with the academic rigour to admit instead students who can't.