Protesters and St Paul's

[Guest]

Hello


... one little thought. I’ve just heard some of the best singing I’ve ever heard, with a fantastic choir, in this indescribably beautiful building, but the people in the choir outnumbered those of us in the church. Why is it that we have one of the greatest assets in all world music in these cathedral choirs and only a handful or two of people turn up to listen to them? It’s quite extraordinary.

]

That's a handful or two more than will be listening to evensong at St Paul's!

What a disgraceful decision by the Dean and Chapter. It just cannot be reasonably justified to close the cathedral for worship.

VCC

[decantor]

That's a handful or two more than will be listening to evensong at St Paul's!

What a disgraceful decision by the Dean and Chapter. It just cannot be reasonably justified to close the cathedral for worship. VCC

More than that.....only a couple of days ago the Dean appeared on TV at the top of the steps, declaring how welcome the protesters were. Now the mighty west door has been slammed shut, though there's been precious little sign of anti-religion among the anti-capitalists. One has to wonder what precisely is going on.

[orbis factor]

That's a handful or two more than will be listening to evensong at St Paul's!

What a disgraceful decision by the Dean and Chapter. It just cannot be reasonably justified to close the cathedral for worship.

VCC

Perhaps, VCC, if you might remove your head from out of the sand (or anything else, for that matter) for a minute you might be able to acknowledge other contributory factors towards the closure - like health and safety, for example? - and therefore appreciate the difficult position St P's find themselves in. Just a thought.

[Magnificat]

Perhaps, VCC, if you might remove your head from out of the sand (or anything else, for that matter) for a minute you might be able to acknowledge other contributory factors towards the closure - like health and safety, for example? - and therefore appreciate the difficult position St P's find themselves in. Just a thought.

Whose safety exactly?

Health and Safety is used too easily to excuse any difficulty. The Health and Safety Executive themselves are urging people to challenge these decisions to ensure that they are applied as was originally attended to deal with genuine health and safety in the workplace not as some sort of nannying or for fear of compensation claims.

The protesters outside are peaceful, well educated, middle class types. Some even attended the early morning communion service the other day.

What danger do they pose to tourists or worshippers wanting to enter St Paul's?

Do you think the RCs at Westminster Cathedral would close its doors to worshippers if they set up camp on the piazza outside. Not bloody likely they've got more faith for a start.

This is the first time St Paul's has closed its doors since the second world war and why? - for elf and safety. Good God Almighty!!

As I said - a disgraceful decision.

VCC

[orbis factor]

Whose safety exactly?

Health and Safety is used too easily to excuse any difficulty. The Health and Safety Executive themselves are urging people to challenge these decisions to ensure that they are applied as was originally attended to deal with genuine health and safety in the workplace not as some sort of nannying or for fear of compensation claims.

The protesters outside are peaceful, well educated, middle class types. Some even attended the early morning communion service the other day.

What danger do they pose to tourists or worshippers wanting to enter St Paul's?

Do you think the RCs at Westminster Cathedral would close its doors to worshippers if they set up camp on the piazza outside. Not bloody likely they've got more faith for a start.

This is the first time St Paul's has closed its doors since the second world war and why? - for elf and safety. Good God Almighty!!

As I said - a disgraceful decision.

VCC

You're crediting yourself with enough inside knowledge of this situation and its obvious difficulties and conflicts to be in a position to make an informed comment/make a judgement on this one. They say ignorance is bliss - but until you've made yourself aware of all the facts and surrounding issues here, I'd keep quiet if I were you.

[orbis factor]

Whose safety exactly?

Health and Safety is used too easily to excuse any difficulty. The Health and Safety Executive themselves are urging people to challenge these decisions to ensure that they are applied as was originally attended to deal with genuine health and safety in the workplace not as some sort of nannying or for fear of compensation claims.

The protesters outside are peaceful, well educated, middle class types. Some even attended the early morning communion service the other day.

What danger do they pose to tourists or worshippers wanting to enter St Paul's?

Do you think the RCs at Westminster Cathedral would close its doors to worshippers if they set up camp on the piazza outside. Not bloody likely they've got more faith for a start.

This is the first time St Paul's has closed its doors since the second world war and why? - for elf and safety. Good God Almighty!!

As I said - a disgraceful decision.

VCC

Naturally, you've been there to assess the scene and see for yourself before making your comments..

[MrGongGong]

I heard a hilarious Tory mp (?) on question time today say that Jesus never did anything political
its not my religion but (apart from the Samba bands ) it seems exactly what the church should be doing !

[DracoM]

AFAICS, JC was sufficiently political for both the Roman and Pharisaic communities to be scared witless of the following he had for all sorts of reasons.

[ardcarp]

...and St Paul himself might have had a few political vibes.

[MrGongGong]

...and St Paul himself might have had a few political vibes.

Paulism is the worst part of christianity IMV

[Magnificat]

Naturally, you've been there to assess the scene and see for yourself before making your comments..

Evidently according to the Dean, in today's papers, they are frightened that all the heating apparatus being used by the protesters could set fire to the cathedral and fire engines will not be able to get through to put it out - absolute b-ll--ks!!

If that was the case then the police would move the protesters on for safety reasons, St Paul's wouldn't have to close. And why have none of the surrounding businesses not stopped working they would be just as much at risk?

No what they are trying to do is to coerce the protesters into leaving so that the tourists they have lost will come back and their shop and restaurant can make money again - its entirely commercial considerations - I wonder what Jesus Christ would say about that? At present they are losing some £20,000 a day in the shop - how closing the cathedral can make that situation better baffles me and what has it got to do with worship and calling off all tomorrow's services?

I see they let a couple marry there today so why not let people attend services tomorrow?

VCC

[orbis factor]

Evidently according to the Dean, in today's papers, they are frightened that all the heating apparatus being used by the protesters could set fire to the cathedral and fire engines will not be able to get through to put it out - absolute b-ll--ks!!

If that was the case then the police would move the protesters on for safety reasons, St Paul's wouldn't have to close. And why have none of the surrounding businesses not stopped working they would be just as much at risk?

No what they are trying to do is to coerce the protesters into leaving so that the tourists they have lost will come back and their shop and restaurant can make money again - its entirely commercial considerations - I wonder what Jesus Christ would say about that? At present they are losing some £20,000 a day in the shop - how closing the cathedral can make that situation better baffles me and what has it got to do with worship and calling off all tomorrow's services?

I see they let a couple marry there today so why not let people attend services tomorrow?

VCC

Again - purely speculation on your part. As usual, you seem blinded by your own ignorance.

[Flosshilde]

Perhaps, VCC, if you might remove your head from out of the sand (or anything else, for that matter) for a minute you might be able to acknowledge other contributory factors towards the closure - like health and safety, for example? - and therefore appreciate the difficult position St P's find themselves in. Just a thought.

Orbis, you accuse Magnificat of speculating (not in the financial sense )- this post of yours is of course based on information from the Cathedral authorities?

I heard the Dean (I assume) in a news item oin the radio say that he thought that the protestors' work had been done - they had 'raised awarenes', & could now fold their tents & steal away. He doesn't seem to understand that if the protesters disappear people will forget, & that the point of that type of protest is that it is permanent.

[DracoM]

I can see their aim / cause, but for my money this is an own goal: the British are likely to forgive peaceful protesters a lot, but to block a hugely important church from operating is asking for big PR trouble. The pix, the reportage, the interviews, the loss of public sympathy over a very un-British form of protest? Clueless IMO.

Round the corner is the Bank of England. So why the heck choose St Paul's? Yes, it's highly visible, will carry big images round the world - for a day or two, but in wider Britain, my guess is that the reaction will be rather one of serious disapproval. Sad, because the basic cause to campaign against irresponsible greed has some ethical legs, but to do it like this does not IMO show much savvy.

[orbis factor]

Orbis, you accuse Magnificat of speculating (not in the financial sense )- this post of yours is of course based on information from the Cathedral authorities?


I heard the Dean (I assume) in a news item oin the radio say that he thought that the protestors' work had been done - they had 'raised awarenes', & could now fold their tents & steal away. He doesn't seem to understand that if the protesters disappear people will forget, & that the point of that type of protest is that it is permanent.

This isn't an appropriate arena to comment on that - only to say that it must be frustrating for those who may be a little more enlightened in the business to read tosh written on what should be a board devoted to informed discussion.