CE: St Paul’s Church, Knightsbridge, London 15.ii.23

[jonfan]

There are three things you can do with music as far as I’m aware: compose it, perform it and listen to it. On CE the musicians perform it. I had an exchange of views with a vicar some while ago where he complained the choir ‘performed the anthem’ by which he meant we rehearsed it beforehand, any old standard was acceptable for a service apparently.
If a choir is booked for a radio CE any casual eavesdropping by microphones is not on; everyone will want to make sure they do their best. Perhaps some posters here think that if there’s plenty of quite demanding music, with instruments in addition to the organ, then it’s a concert. The presence of lessons and prayers means attendees are at a service.

[ardcarp]

Can anyone post up what version was being used for the Bible reading? I know I'm an old fogey, but modern translations of familiar words just jar sometimes.

[cat]

Can anyone post up what version was being used for the Bible reading? I know I'm an old fogey, but modern translations of familiar words just jar sometimes.

I believe it was the New Revised Standard Version Anglicised Edition.

[ardcarp]

Thanks, cat.

[chrisjstanley]

Indeed, I always feel it is a missed opportunity when Psalm 78 isn't on the menu (OK the anthem was a bit of a nod). I do hope that the Ashfield version makes it onto choral evensong one day. IMO the finest pointing and choice of chants there is.

[Keraulophone]

Perhaps some posters here think that if there’s plenty of quite demanding music, with instruments in addition to the organ, then it’s a concert. The presence of lessons and prayers means attendees are at a service.

However, in over three decades of singing BBC broadcast CEs, I have, thankfully, never been applauded by the congregation.

Audiences applaud at the end of a concert.
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[Keraulophone]

Indeed, I always feel it is a missed opportunity when Psalm 78 isn't on the menu (OK the anthem was a bit of a nod).

Roll on live CEs on the 15th Evening from Exeter Cathedral, York Minster and other places where the BCP Psalmody is sung.
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[Vox Humana]

I do hope that the Ashfield version makes it onto choral evensong one day. IMO the finest pointing and choice of chants there is.

Oh yes—but it needs to be done by a choir that has the chants "in its blood". The recording on Priory Records' second Psalms of David series is a disappointment.

[MS0]

to BR,

......but I still find it hard to escape the feeling that too often such 'services' as that from Knightsbridge feel closer to a concert than an 'eavesdropped' service .

These days, just about all cathedral / 'greater church' choirs are conducted, and there is more rehearsal time allocated for choirs to prepare services (routine or special) than was the case a century ago. We might note, for example, David Hurd's recollections in the Bairstow biography "Blessed City" about taking afternoon tea with the Bairstows at 3.30 before walking to the Minster at 3.45 for Evensong ("often broadcast") at 4.00 - that kind of timetable would never happen nowadays! Given that so many elements of concert hall finesse have crept into church music, especially in connection with broadcasts which (whether live or recorded) are preceded by a lengthy afternoon of rehearsals with balance testing, it is no wonder that they look, feel, sound and taste like concerts.

The question might be asked: what would we want to see done about this?

Nothing at all, accepting that change has happened whether we consider it for better or worse?

Or perhaps a move back towards the way things used to be? It's hard to see that happening, especially in an age where it is no longer always a prerequisite that Directors of Music are organists, thus one finds cathedrals employing conductors rather than organists when a top musical job has to be filled. If the conductor cannot play, would s/he willingly step aside and do nothing to lead the choir in service, even if that service has the BBC in attendance? That would at best be seen as ludicrous, and at worst lead congregations, Deans and Chapters to ask why they are paying for a Director of Music if said person doesn't direct.

Of course, with regard to this particular broadcast there is the specific case that an orchestra was involved. It's actually not unique: some places lay on an orchestra for services such as Christmas Day Eucharist or Easter Day Evensong - even without those being broadcast - and with no other intention than making the music that little bit more special to befit such a major day on the liturgical calendar.