Westminster Cathedral : Martin Baker resigned

[Vox Humana]

I think that this isn't exactly right, VH; in the immediate postwar period there was huge promotion of public funded Arts, including Music. The Festival of Britain, the South Bank Centre, the number of Orchestras, the foundation of the Arts Council, the Third Programme, the promotion of Arts on the BBC, the Open University - I would say that the period 1945-79 was a golden age for the Arts - including Classical Music - in Britain.

You're absolutely right, of course, in your assessment that there is a strong tradition of philistinism in post-Industrial Revolution British History, which, as now, often had the dominant voice in political power. But this tradition has also been periodically successfully challenged by those who value the Arts - figures like Newman & Wood, Robert Meyer, William Glock, Jennie Lee - and the enlightened Heads mentioned in Day's excellent book who swam against the prevailing tide in the 19th Century and who employed and supported their Directors of Music.

I wouldn't disagree seriously with any of what you write, Ferney, but maybe it could be nuanced. The clientele for the arts in the post-war period was mainly the adults in society who had been brought up in an age in which classical music was still widely valued. I strongly suspect that the decline could be linked to the rise of popular music for the younger generation from the '50s onwards, initially skiffle, then rock-and-roll and the rest. When I was a teenager in the '60s, most of my contemporaries were mainly or exclusively interested in 'pop' music - it was the age of the Beatles and the Stones when the whole 'pop' scene exploded. We are all now of pensionable age. As a result, to most people today the term 'musician' automatically conjures up an image of someone engaged in the popular or light music industry; they rarely think in terms of classical music unless prompted. The priesthood today is made up predominantly of people brought up on 'pop' music; their flocks ditto. Is it any wonder that the church is apt to view classical church music as irrelevant (especially in those places where the performances are painfully amateur?) So, while there are most certainly many figureheads who have strongly fought the case for the arts, they have had limited impact in the realm of music. Other arts, such as theatre and film, have fared much better.

[ardcarp]

Moving the argument to music in schools, there has been a disastrous decline in the state sector, partly due to funding shortages. There has been a frighteningly rapid shrinkage (in some cases total disappearance) of County music peripatetic teachers, Youth Orchestras and so on. Independent schools, OTOH have valued music very highly, some having truly spectacular lists of full-time and visiting music staff. A cynic might say this is a shop window for their prospectuses...but it might be fairer to say that enlightened heads and governors see what value the Arts bring to pupils' (sorry, students') confidence, personal development and academic achievement. What adult will ever forget the wonder of acting in a play, singing in a choir or playing in an orchestra as a child?

Unfortunately I have a personal dilemma about all this. Leaving music aside, there has never in my lifetime been a greater rift between the haves and have-nots. If I thought abolition of independent schools would alter things one jot, I would vote for any party who put it in their manifesto.

Ducks for cover.

[Vox Humana]

If I thought abolition of independent schools would alter things one jot, I would vote for any party who put it in their manifesto.

Half of me agrees with this entirely. The other half wonders why it has to be a race to the bottom. What would really excite me is a party that promised to raise the resources and standards of state education to a level where the private schools would simply collapse under their own redundancy. (Yes, I know, but one can dream!)

[ardcarp]

That's pretty much my view, VH. Put so much more succinctly!

[Vox Humana]

[BBMmk2]

The demise of choir schools, nationally?

[mw963]

Desperately sad, what sheer bloody idiots the top Catholic brass at WC must be. In fact they clearly need flushing. And yes, that IS rude of me.

I also greatly admire Mr Baker's skills as an organist, and treasure to this day his playing of the Harris Prelude, followed by one of the best and most dignified improvisations I've ever heard in my life, at the funeral of the Princess of Wales. And for a magnificent rendering of Orb and Sceptre at the end of a CE from Westminster Abbey in 1993, marking the 40th anniversary of the Coronation.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

What would really excite me is a party that promised to raise the resources and standards of state education to a level where the private schools would simply collapse under their own redundancy. (Yes, I know, but one can dream!)

Well ... there was one Party at the last Election that committed to a £10.5 billion increase in state school funding, and another £160 million specifically for Arts teaching in Primary schools, but that commitment didn't seem to get very much attention ...

[DracoM]

Music in choirs, orchestras and bands is communal, requires intense co-operation and skill. Interestingly, among others, the digital industries find musicians and linguists very well qualified for their game - instant translation from one set of codings to another.

How any nation / organisation eg Drome etc can seriously think that cutting such opportunities is going to enhance their image, effectiveness, usefulness and ultimately spiritual health simply eludes me completely.

BUT as implied up-thread, the whole Westminster Catholic mindset is under serious examination in all manner of fields. Boy, do we miss Hume.

[Once Was 4]

Music in choirs, orchestras and bands is communal, requires intense co-operation and skill. Interestingly, among others, the digital industries find musicians and linguists very well qualified for their game - instant translation from one set of codings to another.

How any nation / organisation eg Drome etc can seriously think that cutting such opportunities is going to enhance their image, effectiveness, usefulness and ultimately spiritual health simply eludes me completely.

BUT as implied up-thread, the whole Westminster Catholic mindset is under serious examination in all manner of fields. Boy, do we miss Hume.

Anybody got anything to say about what passes for arts coverage on the BBC 1 'Breakfast' TV magazine programme. A few oddball nonentities from the realms of punk etc., elderly pop musicians dragged out from well-earned obscurity and, of course, lots of Holywood glitz. Or is it me that is getting grumpy?

[Vox Humana]

Anybody got anything to say about what passes for arts coverage on the BBC 1 'Breakfast' TV magazine programme. A few oddball nonentities from the realms of punk etc., elderly pop musicians dragged out from well-earned obscurity and, of course, lots of Holywood glitz. Or is it me that is getting grumpy?

This is evidence of what I mentioned up-thread - as is the screamingly irritating, drums-with-everything music we hear alongside the screamingly patronising BBC trailer adverts (and probably on other channels too, but I hardly ever watch them and then only from hard-disk so I can skip the adverts). British musical culture is basically popular and beat-based; classical music is only a niche tangent. The latter, including the sort of church music we like, is ultimately doomed unless the whole British attitude to music can be improved. As a happy-clappy priest once readily agreed, if the people of the land were clamouring for classical music, the church would be falling over itself to provide it.

I don't know what other options there might be around Westminster, but most people go to cathedrals wanting to see and hear good liturgy and music performed to the highest standard. Without that they might just as well go anywhere else - or nowhere. What those responsible at Westminster have done is the liturgical equivalent of redesigning the Toblerone bar, or downsizing the Quality Street tin. I can't see it ending well.

[Keraulophone]

Moving the argument to music in schools, there has been a disastrous decline in the state sector, partly due to funding shortages...
Leaving music aside, there has never in my lifetime been a greater rift between the haves and have-nots. If I thought abolition of independent schools would alter things one jot, I would vote for any party who put it in their manifesto.

1. Music in the Catholic Church in Britain - it’s past, present and future (if it has one outside Leeds)
2. Music in the Catholic Church in France - do we want this to happen here?
3. Music in our Anglican parish churches - diversity and decline
4. Music in our Anglican cathedrals, greater churches and university chapels - never better, but a fragile entity
5. Music in our state schools - lamentable decline
6. Music in our independent schools - islands of excellence, with local trickle-down effects
7. UK Government policy on music education - damaging, wilful ignorance
8. Music in the wider Anglican Church, eg Episcopalian (USA) - huge diversity: from big $ funding to non-existent
9. Increasing social and economic inequality within British Society - off the leash since Thatcher
10. Uneven economic development in Britain - theory, practice, and government/EU policy on convergence 1945-2020

If I had the time (and the inclination) I’d write a paragraph under each heading, which are all IMV linked directly or indirectly, to this disgraceful state of affairs at the Drome/W.Cath. We have an ex-Drome Organ Scholar as Acting Asst. Organist at present, so we’re fairly up-to-date with the sorry situation.

There are no easy answers. Every responsible institution has to identify its own priorities, which may not seem to reflect local or national goals. The Cardinal, the Headmaster and their advisers are possibly self-regarding, myopic, incompetent or otherwise; but there is little that those outside the loop can do to change their decision once the authorities have gone beyond a certain stage. So the vastly talented Martin Baker has no option but to resign. The opposite is happening in my neck of the woods, where the music at the cathedral is highly valued and flourishing under a regime which, during my thirty years in the choir, has always lent the music department its full support through thick and thin.

In the current circumstances (we are poorest county in Britain by GDP pc) we can only try our best to ensure that the trickle-down effects (para.6) are strong enough to reach the maximum number of local and visiting hearts and minds, especially among the young, which may help some small measure of local convergence within our inevitably unequal regional economy and society; inevitable, it has been said by the left, due to the logic of the capitalist mode of production - but there’s little potential wealth creation in the performance of sacred music in church! The churches and chapels around here were bulging and had far more music reverberating around their walls when copper and tin were being mined (lights out in 1998) and workers were being ‘exploited’ for their hard labour.

[DracoM]

" The Choir of Westminster Cathedral is recognised as one of the finest in the world, its principal focus being the daily celebration of the Divine Office and Solemn Mass. Since its foundation in 1901 it has occupied a unique and enviable position at the forefront of English church music, famous both for its distinctive continental sound as well as its repertoire. The Choir has made regular recordings since its foundation and continues to do so today.
Comprising up to 20 boy trebles and altos aged 8-13 and ten professional Lay Clerks, the Choir remains the only Catholic Cathedral choir in the world to sing daily Mass and Vespers, whilst also performing concerts at home and abroad."

The Drome's own website describes the place of the choir well.
Wonder if the parents / govs / Cardinal et al actually remembered that.

How ironic does it all now sound? Sigh.

[ardcarp]

1. Music in the Catholic Church in Britain - it’s past, present and future (if it has one outside Leeds)
2. Music in the Catholic Church in France - do we want this to happen here?
3. Music in our Anglican parish churches - diversity and decline
4. Music in our Anglican cathedrals, greater churches and university chapels - never better, but a fragile entity
5. Music in our state schools - lamentable decline
6. Music in our independent schools - islands of excellence, with local trickle-down effects
7. UK Government policy on music education - damaging, wilful ignorance
8. Music in the wider Anglican Church, eg Episcopalian (USA) - huge diversity: from big $ funding to non-existent
9. Increasing social and economic inequality within British Society - off the leash since Thatcher
10. Uneven economic development in Britain - theory, practice, and government/EU policy on convergence 1945-2020


May I add:

11. BBCTV Woeful coverage of music. Couldn't there be live coverage of at least one concert/opera/ballet per week on BBC4 ?

And yes, Truro Cathedral is a beacon of hope!

[Resurgam]

[QUOTE=ardcarp;773540]
3. Music in our Anglican parish churches - diversity and decline
4. Music in our Anglican cathedrals, greater churches and university chapels - never better, but a fragile entity

3. Girls have taken over almost completely from boys.

4. I remember reading a quote from Stephen Cleobury just before he died where he said that King's was having difficulty getting the necessary commitment from parents who, like those at Westminster Cathedral, wish to see more of their children these days.

It is difficult to see the choral tradition continuing, at least in the same form as now, commitment by all involved being the most important part of it all.