JSB sacred cantatas: which are your favourites, and why?

[teamsaint]

It's difficult to talk very much about "development" in these works, ts, as so many of them were written within a period of two-three years (1723-25) - only about twenty were written before this period in his life. The differences in "style" within the remaining 180-ish Cantatas are more to do with the requirements of the text and occasion being marked - and the circumstances of the week that the composer wrote the work (for example if, on a Thursday, Bach discovered that one of his prize soloists had gone down with a cold - or his voice had broken - then it might have been a matter of writing a substitute aria [or adapting an already existing one if he had to do a pile of Latin marking] for whoever was available who wasn't sneezing). There is uncertainty in many instances of exactly which year in that "three" year period a Cantata was written ... and the BWV numbers are of little help in getting an idea of the chronological order of the works.

Thanks for that Ferney. So much easier than going to the library ......

I wasnt aware that the majority were written in a short period.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Thanks for that Ferney. So much easier than going to the library ......

The local council are considering closing me down.

I wasnt aware that the majority were written in a short period.

It's an astonishing achievement - writing a Cantata (or two) each week, including writing out the parts (he had help in this from the family and other trusted pupils), and preparing the singers and instrumentalists, throughout the year. No holidays, presumably, plus training the choirs for the other churches he was responsible for, writing and preparing the organ pieces, and teaching classes of schoolkids Music and Latin lessons! (Apparently he wasn't a very good Latin teacher, so only "Satisfactory" on his OFSTED report.)

[Dave2002]

Possibly (probably?) because it was the first I listened to in earnest, O Ewigkeit, du Donnerwort, BWV 60. How come it was my first? 'Simples':



That was half a century ago, and still I am drawn back to it again and again, though not now in that recording, which I only have on LP (indeed, I don't think it has ever made it to CD).

I can't find that exact LP on CD, though the Berg is available to stream from Apple and Spotify. I also found this thread elsewhere about the Berg - http://www.good-music-guide.com/comm...?topic=16812.0 which gives new (to me) "light" about that composer, but not particularly relevant to this thread.

Now I need to listen to the cantata - not sure if I've ever heard it outside of the quote in the concerto.

[Pulcinella]

Possibly (probably?) because it was the first I listened to in earnest, O Ewigkeit, du Donnerwort, BWV 60. How come it was my first? 'Simples':



That was half a century ago, and still I am drawn back to it again and again, though not now in that recording, which I only have on LP (indeed, I don't think it has ever made it to CD).

SNAP
Mentioned elsewhere, I'm sure.
An ideal coupling, I thought at the time, and still do!

[BBMmk2]

I believe, I’m not sure by whom, that the cantatas once heard through, they are like the Forth Bridge. Once you have been over it, you go, again and again.

[mopsus]

SNAP
Mentioned elsewhere, I'm sure.
An ideal coupling, I thought at the time, and still do!

I love BWV 60 for this reason too, although I am still brought up short by hearing the chorale without Berg's music around it. (Suk's performance is one of the finest recordings of Berg's concerto, the recommended recording the last time but one that it was featured on Building a Library). For anyone exploring the cantatas, I recommend the Bach Cantatas website; this page http://www.bach-cantatas.com/CM/Es-ist-genug.htm gives lots of information about this chorale, including its use by other composers.

In a couple of weeks I'll be listening to Collegium Vocale's disc of some Advent Cantatas which I always bring out at the appropriate season. These are the ones based on Nun komm der Heiden Heiland and it is fascinating to see how Bach reharmonises the melody and treats it in different ways. I am fortunate to have the whole set of Koopman's recordings of the cantatas; these include the secular ones too (generally on discs of their own) plus a few oddities such as the fragmentary Quodlibet which is some sort of musical joke (I suppose you really had to be there). And yes, it is really hard to choose a favourite. Even the most fawning of the secular cantatas have gorgeous music, often hard to tell in style from the sacred works.

[vinteuil]

Even the most fawning of the secular cantatas have gorgeous music, often hard to tell in style from the sacred works.

... indeed, they often have the same notes

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[Pulcinella]

In a couple of weeks I'll be listening to Collegium Vocale's disc of some Advent Cantatas which I always bring out at the appropriate season. These are the ones based on Nun komm der Heiden Heiland and it is fascinating to see how Bach reharmonises the melody and treats it in different ways.

I have the Archiv JEG Advent Cantatas compilation (61, 36, 62) and often do the same.

[BasilHarwood]

I have the Archiv JEG Advent Cantatas compilation (61, 36, 62) and often do the same.

The best cantatas right there. And BWV 4...

[ardcarp]

I've had Cantata 82 (Ich habe genug) in my head all day since you posed the question Pulcs. I see someone else has mentioned it above. So also the Naxos St John Passion with Edward Higginbottom and New College Oxford, but that's not a 'cantata' and it's not Passiontide. But why not? ( ETO is doing the St Matthew round the country this month.)

[vinteuil]

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... the other question, of course, is which box / set of Cantatas one wd choose - Kuijken, Herreweghe, Leonhardt/Harnoncourt, Suzuki, Gardiner, Leusink, Koopman...

Koopman is the only one of these I haven't experienced - do people who know it, rate it? Is it too full of Koopmanisms??


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[Bryn]

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... the other question, of course, is which box / set of Cantatas one wd choose - Kuijken, Herreweghe, Leonhardt/Harnoncourt, Suzuki, Gardiner, Leusink, Koopman...

Koopman is the only one of these I haven't experienced - do people who know it, rate it? Is it too full of Koopmanisms??


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You get something of a smorgasbord of some of those in the Bach 333 box.

[Pulcinella]

I've had Cantata 82 (Ich habe genug) in my head all day since you posed the question Pulcs. I see someone else has mentioned it above.

In addition to the Harnoncourt/Leonhardt box and the JEG Advent set mentioned, I have two Decca compilations that probably should have got thrown out with the non-HIPP bathwater, but never mind:
80 and 140 with Munchinger, and 170 (Janet Baker), 82 (John Shirley-Quirk), and 159 (both JB and JSQ, with Robert Tear), which are with the ASMF and Marriner.
But I can see that it really is time to 'open the box' and start exploring.

[Richard Barrett]

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... the other question, of course, is which box / set of Cantatas one wd choose - Kuijken, Herreweghe, Leonhardt/Harnoncourt, Suzuki, Gardiner, Leusink, Koopman...

Koopman is the only one of these I haven't experienced - do people who know it, rate it? Is it too full of Koopmanisms??

The Koopman set has some beautiful things in it, but a lot of it is too smoothly polished for its own good in my opinion. Plus, I'm not sure it's just because I happen to know that it was recorded piecemeal according to scoring, rather than cantata by cantata, but it also seems somewhat disconnected, and lacking in the spiritual drama that motivates each work (which Gardiner is much more successful with, as you'd expect from live recordings). I bought them as they came out for a while, but this eventually ground to a halt when I noticed myself getting less and less interested in each new release. These days I usually listen to the OVPP recordings under Kuijken, Pierlot, Rifkin or with Montreal Baroque, and go back to Harnoincourt/Leonhardt or Gardiner for anything that's missing from those.

[vinteuil]

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... thank you, Richard - that is helpful.

I love the Kuijken, it is currently my preferred set -

http://amzn.eu/d/2sObP8a

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