Enjoyable singing. Quite dated mens' sound IMO...but 1973 is a long time ago. One treble had a rather intrusive glottal-stop attack. Recording was well back, allowing the very resonant acoustic to work its magic. No comment on the 'sermon'. As CE in those days was shorter, we got VW Te Deum in G as a bonus. Anyone remember the C.S. Lang adaptation with a part for massed adolescent voices?
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What struck me while listening to today's broadcast, was how the communication of the music and liturgy in a meaningful way took precedence over the bland striving for perfection, eg in intonation, blend and ensemble, that we often encounter forty years later. Thus Barry Rose imbued the Parsons 'Ave Maria' with an intimacy and flexibility that drew us into the worship, while the voices remained characterful and held our interest, even against the traffic noise. The choir were equally attentive to the spoken parts of the service, and Arundel were fortunate to have Ian Richardson (in Francis Urquhart mode) on hand to read the lesson (!).
Jean: Arundel Cathedral do have a mixed voice voluntary choir as well as a junior choir at present.Comment
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I had somewhat mixed reactions to this broadcast. I liked the Ives antiphons - incisive little interjections. Psalms a bit slow for my taste, but impressive enough. Last week's Chichester diction was better.
What I rather resisted were the Byrd Short Service and the Parsons - at least, the performance of them, for the Parsons is a sublime anthem. The Byrd I felt was just somewhat plodding and as elsewhere in the service episodic, tempi much manipulated and at times came within a whisper of a wallow - 'big sound, huge acoustic so let's glory in it'? And, oh, yes, like ardcarp, I found myself tutting with exasperation over that child who hit the initial 'A' of almost every 'As / And' at the begnning of phrases a nanosecond before anyone else with monotomous regularity. All round decently sung, yes - here and much of the time throughout, altos pick of the bunch for me.
In the Parsons, to my ears, the boys were frankly pretty well blown away by the overwhelming sound of the generally energetic and excellent men. Which is sad, because the interplay of the top two lines is exquisite and here rather went for nothing in the melange. I'm afraid 'intimacy' was precisely for me what that performance lacked!
Interestingly, the RVW was crisper - sharper acoustic played a part here, of course I fully accept. Boy sound? OK, bit dated, rounder, more old style King's than you'd generally hear today, but that style too has its virtues.
Nice period piece.Comment
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Draco,
What on earth are you talking about the Parson's Ave Maria was superb. Very few choirs today, and I doubt many in 1973, would get anywhere near it. I have just listened to some of Christ Church, Oxford, at that time in the 70s when Simon Preston was in the ascendant. His boys were not in the same league and to compare that Guildford choir in any way with Chichester last week is, frankly, a joke.
Early entries didn't worry Barry, it was the communication that he wanted and as Keraulophone says didn't those boys communicate.
Lovely rich, sonorous singing and with no ducking the high notes.
The Vaughan Williams Te Deum - what a bonus.
VCCComment
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I'd say that's a fair assessment Draco. Liked the Ives, thought the Byrd strangely slow, and the Parsons far too heroic at times in some of the middle voices. Having said that, a lovely overall sound.Originally posted by DracoM View PostComment
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VCC Having sung (and once rather nervously played) for BR, may I assert that EARLY ENTRIES bothered him a great deal!!! The man certainly had a knack with choirs, and I understand your admiration for him, but the 'sainthood' bestowed upon him is meant to have a touch of irony.Early entries didn't worry BarryComment
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Surely better to communicate on the beat if possible.Originally posted by Magnificat View Post
This reminds me of a story that circulated when I was at Guildford. A new member of the back row was finding BR's somewhat lugubrious beat rather hard to follow, and was confused by the fact that the choir consistently came in after the beat. When he asked exactly how long he should wait after the downbeat before coming in, he was told 'When you can't stand the silence any longer'.My boxes are positively disintegrating under the sheer weight of ticks. Ed ReardonComment
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Story, apocryphal or not, explains a bit. Those Guildford boys actually sounded more than a little on the edge of being scared, not empowered. Only IMO of course.Comment
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It is true, it is true - it was while rehearsing Psalm 130 - 'Out of the deep' to the 'after Purcell' chant - it was a Cantoris Bass who asked the question.... I heard it from BR's own lips in the 'Lower Red Lion' in Fishpool Street.
All of which is entirely subsumed into the fact the Barry always always made it clear the the sung liturgy was a form of prayer. Leading and being offered. I agree totally with all those posters who find a depth of meaning in his work - it stems from total faith in the importance of what the entire ensemble was doing. Admirable, and rare.Comment
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muticus
If you're going to play the AMDG card, may I just surmise that the Almighty would prefer His praises to be synchronised?Comment
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Let us not forget - "the beat is irrelevant". I recall a discussion on the old R3 boards regarding the relative conducting skill of DOMs. I maintain that it certainly helps to have "stick", but ultimately comes down to the ability to project one's intent. It also helps if singers can intuit what they are seeing. There are always a few in every choir that can do no more or less than they are specifically told.Comment
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I didn't notice that. The trebles were allowed full throttle from time to time, but were at their best at mp and below, where there was a controlled delicacy and sensitivity that is only occasionally on display in 2011. It reminded me of the George Guest and Stanley Vann choirs. I enjoyed the Guildford singing in that it exhibited the merits of a style that seems to have passed into history.Originally posted by DracoM View Post
OTOH, I watched BMR take a choral master-class in 2006, using the choristers of Chichester and Salisbury as guinea-pigs. It was, of course, more cabaret than master-class - great fun for the capacity audience, and much that was stimulating for the young singers. However, during a non-singing moment, one large Salisbury lad dared to put a hand in his pocket. Our jocular compere instantly turned dragon and flamed him with three words and a snort: the boy blushed so deeply that one expected his hair to fall out. Yes, boys need discipline.......but humiliation? Well, this baby fell a-thinking.Comment
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decantor, that sad little story is by no means uncommon ref BR, and my comments about the Guildford trebles were but the tiniest hint. Not sure that if your trebs are at their best singing mp it is useful to encourage your men to give it fuller throttle against them. In that Parsons, the boys virtually disappeared for bars at a time when the music suggests they ought to be quite audible, while, OTOH, the men proclaimed their own skills quite loudly. Balance? Or is that 'interpretation'?Comment
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I should point out too that of course all anecdotes are open to a number of interpretations. As decantor suggests, one reader of that story might see it as appropriate correction of slovenly attitudes, while another might see it as an example of an unfortunate attempt to publicly humiliate.Comment
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Yes, Barry could be very much the disciplinarian by today's standards.
When he was at St Albans he would stride into choir practice on the dot at 4.28pm and wait for the boys to arrive at 4.30 exactly in an orderly crocodile marshalled by the head chorister. There would be absolutely no mucking about during practise and any running after practise would be met with the offender being called back from wherever he had got to and made to walk out properly. I saw him tear a real strip of one boy for writng on his copy. All this was very much in public. Very different from what happens there today and not necessarily for the better.
Barry is old school and no doubt agreed with Stanley Vann that the service began as soon as the boys entered the cathedral.
The Salisbury Master Class incident came well after he had retired and he was probably well out of date in his approach by then but it is rather unfair to criticise him for being someone of his time and for what was his style.
I don't think that boys should be humiliated but discipline is not humiliation and you cannot have an effective rehearsal without being able to make spontaneous comments whether singing is going on at the time or not.
Look at schools today. In my day the kids were terrorised by the teachers; today it's the teachers who are terrorised by the kids. Are things better as a result? I think not.
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