CE Gloucester Cathedral Wed, 9th Dec 2015

[DracoM]

You want 'Vox Dicentis'?
OK, then listen to this - LIVE, btw.

http://www.saintthomaschurch.org/calendar/events/worship/15264/festal-evensong

[jean]

That's two Voces Dicentes...

Voces dicentium, it would have to be.

Only as 'background', so not fair to comment, but I fear that I will never get used to hearing female precentors...

Try pretending they're boys.

[ardcarp]

Try pretending they're boys.

Er...no. That's actually a bit naughty, Jean! There are many things that men..or should I say the male of the species...are almost entirely responsible for. War for a start; but having done a 300 mile trip by car this weekend, at night, I suspect all the drivers who drove up my bumpers with lights blazing, overtook on the inside, forced me out of the way at roundabouts were men. Women, on the whole, are much more considerate as drivers. Where is this taking me? Oh yes. Not especially liking female precenting is not a sexist issue. Nor has it anything to do with the argument about boy-versus-girl-versus-woman in choirs. As you know, Jean, as a father of girl choral scholars, I am not one of the fanatics in that debate. I think it is perfectly OK for members of this Forum to say that they prefer Responses to be intoned at the octave for which they were intended. And for what it's worth, Mrs Ardcarp, who is Woman Militant personified, is of the same opinion...an opinion stated rather more explicitly!

[Pulcinella]

Thanks, ardcarp.
Yes, Jean was a little selective in leaving out the pitch part of my original comment.

[W.Kearns]

Voces dicentium, it would have to be.

Try pretending they're boys.

Well said, Jean. And yes, Ardcarp, I have read your reply.

[quiretenor]

Voces dicentium, it would have to be.

Try pretending they're boys.

An excellent riposte, Jean! As for the arrant nonsense in post no. 18...

[DracoM]

The 'riposte' takes little account of a poster's opinion.
If a choir is used to a precentor pitching it there, then all is well and good. They are doing their job.
Does that mean that the congregation, the radio listeners have to like it?

I know millions who prefer Placido Domingo to Luciano Pavarotti and vice versa, or the eternal Callas / Sutherland debate. All four are excellent, but many listeners / opera-goers have sharply differing opinions. What's not to like? Is one not free to state that opinion?

[jean]

I know millions who prefer Placido Domingo to Luciano Pavarotti and vice versa, or the eternal Callas / Sutherland debate. All four are excellent, but many listeners / opera-goers have sharply differing opinions. What's not to like? Is one not free to state that opinion?

Are you sure that's what you meant?

[jean]

... As for the arrant nonsense in post no. 18...

I didn't really get the bit about wars and bad driving, I have to say.

[ardcarp]

I didn't really get the bit about wars and bad driving, I have to say.

I've had a hard day........

[quiretenor]

I didn't really get the bit about wars and bad driving, I have to say.

No, neither did I. Do boys start wars and drive badly? What a strange world!

If the poster had said "high pitch" rather than female precentors there would have been no problem. And as for the suggestion that there is a "proper pitch" for these sets... what, those written before women became priests? What about those written since? Should we check with the composers? Is this an issue of authenticity? Bizarre! If a countertenor had sung them, then one would of course be free to comment on the high pitch, but it was mentioned in the context of gender, perhaps rather clumsily.

[ardcarp]

Oh dear, if I've really got to explain, my point was.....no; I've lost it.

[Pulcinella]

No, neither did I. Do boys start wars and drive badly? What a strange world!

If the poster had said "high pitch" rather than female precentors there would have been no problem. And as for the suggestion that there is a "proper pitch" for these sets... what, those written before women became priests? What about those written since? Should we check with the composers? Is this an issue of authenticity? Bizarre! If a countertenor had sung them, then one would of course be free to comment on the high pitch, but it was mentioned in the context of gender, perhaps rather clumsily.

Apologies for clumsiness then.
But the problem for me is that female precentors sing at a high pitch.
Telling me to try pretending that they are boys was, I felt, an extremely flippant response.
If I had grown up in a nunnery and been exposed to that high pitch more often, then I'm sure that I would not find it strange.
As Draco has said: surely I am entitled to my opinion, and to express it on this forum.
If others have no problem, then that is their good fortune.
For me, it is a problem, and it will remain so.

[jean]

...surely I am entitled to my opinion, and to express it on this forum...

Of course you are! But am I not, equally, entitled to respond?

[Pulcinella]

Of course you are! But am I not, equally, entitled to respond?

Of course, but preferably without being selective in what you are responding to.
I had the feeling that you willfully ignored the point of what I was saying, which ardcarp, who now seems to be being similarly vilified, caught straight away.