Byrd migration

[DracoM]

Introit: Super flumina Babylonis (de Monte)
Responses: Byrd
Office Hymn: O kind Creator, bow thine ear (Audi Benigne)
Psalms: 65, 66, 67 (Plainchant)
First Lesson: Isaiah 49:1-10
Canticles: The Second Service (Byrd)
Second Lesson: Matthew 10: 24-39
Anthems: Quomodo cantabimus (Byrd)
Hymn: Lord Jesus, think on me (St Paul’s)

Organ Voluntary: Voluntary for my Lady Nevell (Byrd)

[Vox Humana]

Nice to have the de Monte and Byrd's reply to him in the same service.

[Despina dello Stagno]

Nice to have the de Monte and Byrd's reply to him in the same service.

I beg to differ. If the supposition is correct ( and it is certainly plausible) that Byrd's setting is a covert catholic statement, then it has no part in the liturgy of an Anglican choral foundation. It is a misguided provision of music chosen for pleasing effect, divorced of its subversive message, style over content.
One would prefer an Anglican statement about exile: William Child's Woe is Me (that I am constrained to dwell with Mesech and have my habitation among the tents of Kedar), probably written during exile under the Commonwealth) is so much more English, and appropriate.
One does not expect C.E. to be ecumenical.

[jean]

I beg to differ. If the supposition is correct ( and it is certainly plausible) that Byrd's setting is a covert catholic statement, then it has no part in the liturgy of an Anglican choral foundation.

So no more settings of the Lamentations by English composers in the liturgy of an Anglican choral foundation? No more Byrd Ne irascaris/Civitas sancti tui?

[Despina dello Stagno]

So no more settings of the Lamentations by English composers in the liturgy of an Anglican choral foundation? No more Byrd Ne irascaris/Civitas sancti tui?

To ban lamentations is probably more than my job's worth. All the post-restauration composers set such stuff, and the more lugubrious the better. But in this particular item under discussion Byrd has gone just too far to proselytise for the left-footers. Leave it for private devotional services.

(you realise I'm playing devil's advocate?)

P.S. later addition: The Anglican settlement post-restauration (and I use the Frenchified spelling as shorthand to indicate Chas II's client attitude to Louis XIV) had a most self-flagellatory attitude towards the disasters provoked by Laudianism. Job, Joel, Jeremiah, were by far the most frequently set old testament sources, along with the more penitential psalms. And there is no doubt that the composers were all protestant, red in tooth and claw.

[jean]

I don't think we'll get much further unless we manage to define 'Protestant'.

[Despina dello Stagno]

I don't think we'll get much further unless we manage to define 'Protestant'.

I think that is probably too big an ask to tag onto an evensong preview. I believe that a choral foundation que choral foundation should still tacitly observe the 39 articles, and reflect moderate Presbyterianism (although in its day the post-restauration settlement/BCP 1662 was fairly aggressive), with the monarch as supreme governor. That monarchy ad hominem deserves support, so I would reinstate collects for November 5th (Guy Fawkes), January 30th (Charles, King and Martyr) and May 29th (Restoration/Oak Apple Day).

[DracoM]

I don't think we'll get much further unless we manage to define 'Protestant'.

Jean

I don't think we'll get much further with quite a lot of this whole thread.
Am still reeling.

[Miles Coverdale]

I think that is probably too big an ask to tag onto an evensong preview. I believe that a choral foundation que choral foundation should still tacitly observe the 39 articles, and reflect moderate Presbyterianism (although in its day the post-restauration settlement/BCP 1662 was fairly aggressive), with the monarch as supreme governor.

So, all choral foundations should avoid music in Latin, particularly mass settings? The resulting musical poverty would be dire indeed.

[jean]

It may well be that that is what the devil would advocate, but I do believe that even the devil would agree that

...a choral foundation que choral foundation...

might be allowed a Latin qua rather than some ersatz Spanish (or whatever it was).

[french frank]

I think, folks, the 'devil's advocate' reference might be interpreted to mean 'liven things up a bit' ...

Jean - I assume Despina is of the Spell As You Say school, where que = kway!

[jean]

I think, folks, the 'devil's advocate' reference might be interpreted to mean 'liven things up a bit' ...

You mean I failed?

[DracoM]

Always, jean, always!

[ardcarp]

This is Monty Python-esque, viz What's this...the bleedin' Spanish Inquisition?

I must say Despina's original post on the subject is so antithetical to the current world of church music, Anglican, Catholic or otherwise, that I can only assume he had mischievous intent!

Should all Anglicans immediately quit buildings that once graced the Roman rite?

[jean]

I can only assume he had mischievous intent!

Obviously.

But such jeux d'esprit have to be played out according to the terms in which they were set up.

It's not my fault if you missed the point.