New and recent Mahler recordings

[Petrushka]

Thanks for that. I wasn't aware of the new Decca iterations - they look rather handsome, with the orignal artwork duplicated. But, as you say, a bit pricey.

I see the 1967 9th is now on Eloquence: a good move. :)

The Solti/LSO 1, 3 & 9 are now on the Eloquence label and sound very good indeed. 1 & 2 have hardly ever been out of the catalogue in one form or another though the Concertgebouw 4 is bit more elusive. I bought my copy in Paris around 10 years ago and it's a Decca/London Jubilee issue (the US equivalent of the GB Ovation series?).

The Chicago SO discs in the big box are superb but those 1960s LSO recordings are by no means eclipsed.

[HighlandDougie]

The Solti/LSO 1, 3 & 9 are now on the Eloquence label and sound very good indeed:

1 & 2 have hardly ever been out of the catalogue in one form or another though the Concertgebouw 4 is bit more elusive. I bought my copy in Paris around 10 years ago and it's a Decca/London Jubilee issue (the US equivalent of the GB Ovation series?).

The Chicago SO discs in the big box are superb but those 1960s LSO recordings are by no means eclipsed.

1st/3rd:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mahler-Symphonies-Nos-1-3/dp/B073W7MJPW/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1516779352&sr=1-1-fkmr0&keywords=mahler+symphonies+solti+eloquence

9th:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mahler-Georg-Solti-London-Orchestra/dp/B073W7MJPT/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1516779352&sr=1-1&keywords=mahler+symphonies+solti+eloquence

Universal Japan has engaged relatively recently in a fairly comprehensive re-reissue of Solti recordings (as normal CDs, i.e. not as SHM-CDs, UQCDs or SACDs), which mirrors in some ways the Eloquence reissues. The Japanese issues include the 4th:

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/UCCD-4691?s_ssid=e479ea5a68389562d9

which, if Eloquence's sales of 1/3/9 are OK, suggests that they might get round to the 4th - and the 2nd (which I bought last year - Heather Harper and Helen Watts sounding radiant). The starting point for the flurry of pre-Chicago SO Solti reissues has probably been the Universal Korea programme of seemingly remastering and reissuing virtually everything that he recorded. The sound on the Eloquence Mahler 1 and on the Universal Japan reissue of it is, side by side, exactly the same so I think that the source for all the reissues is the Korean programme.

[HighlandDougie]

I’ve bought to many disappointing Jansons discs in my time to be convinced otherwise. There always seems to be one critic somewhere who gets excited by each release, and then further critical analysis by other critics seem to find himso ho hum.
So I repeat The my earlier query: given the mountain of recordings that he has made since the Oslo Tchaikovsky, please point to one—any one—at least in a mainstream work (that exclude Honneger, who is at best, a fringe Composer) where he nails it.
I have the live Beethoven 4-6 on Blu Ray. It’s ok, nothing special. Beethoven is Conductor proof anyway—even M.J. Stopping to admire the view in the first movement of the 5th instead of letting the natural momentum of the work do it’s magic isn’t fatal—but one for the ages, it ain’t

If your contention is that Jansons is one of those conductors, like Lorin Maazel or Zubin Mehta, who, having been taken up by whichever recording company as their "star" conductor, is then over-exposed in too much mainstream repertoire which is OK but not a lot more, then I think that you are probably right (although I will continue to defend his Bavarian LvB!). But, if Honegger is "fringe" and if I'm allowed Mahler as "mainstream", this recent release is pretty special:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=ASIN%3A+B071JD84V9

I saw/heard him conduct the Pittsburgh SO in this symphony sometime in the 1990s, which was also an excellent performance. His LSO Mahler 6th from the 2000s isn't half bad, either.

The Mahler 3rd from Munich, which is less easy to get hold of:

https://www.amazon.de/Mahler-Symphonie-Nr-3-Doppel-CD/dp/B005WV7GNG/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1516781372&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=mahler+3+mariss+jansons

is also very fine (I bought it on the strength of, from memory, Petrushka's enthusiasm for the performance)

I also greatly like this performance:

https://www.amazon.de/Britten-Bavarian-Symphony-Orchestra-2013-09-05/dp/B01K8KOTDK/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1516781280&sr=1-1-fkmr0&keywords=britten+war+requiem+bavarian+radio+symphony+orchestra+mariss+jansons

As a generality, his recordings with the Bavarian RSO seem to bring out the best in him as opposed to those with the RCO (much more uneven: a flaccid Mahler 2nd but a very good Mahler 8th), although this is reputed to contain some very good performances (and some which are probably a bit, "ho hum"):

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mariss-Jansons-Radio-Recordings-1990-2014/product-reviews/B00VXZEXFO/ref=cm_cr_dp_d_btm?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&sortBy=recent#RO8RBIP0O4FSU

I haven't heard it but BBM for one has enthused about at least some of the performances elsewhere on the MB.

[Cockney Sparrow]

I really have to assure myself I really need another version of.....well, anything really. So, I'm glad I can listen online to the Jansens War Requiem (sounding good on my office system) and the RCO Live collection - they are on Spotify and Google Play music. Also Naxos Music Library, where the pdf booklets are available as well. (A lot of the BR Klassik issues can be found on Google Play music and Spotify but the Mahler 3 is not to be found in any of these services).

[BBMmk2]

I really have to assure myself I really need another version of.....well, anything really. So, I'm glad I can listen online to the Jansens War Requiem (sounding good on my office system) and the RCO Live collection - they are on Spotify and Google Play music. Also Naxos Music Library, where the pdf booklets are available as well. (A lot of the BR Klassik issues can be found on Google Play music and Spotify but the Mahler 3 is not to be found in any of these services).

I have been meaning to listen to that particular recording. Thanks for the thumbs up!

[richardfinegold]

If your contention is that Jansons is one of those conductors, like Lorin Maazel or Zubin Mehta, who, having been taken up by whichever recording company as their "star" conductor, is then over-exposed in too much mainstream repertoire which is OK but not a lot more, then I think that you are probably right (although I will continue to defend his Bavarian LvB!). But, if Honegger is "fringe" and if I'm allowed Mahler as "mainstream", this recent release is pretty special:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=ASIN%3A+B071JD84V9

I saw/heard him conduct the Pittsburgh SO in this symphony sometime in the 1990s, which was also an excellent performance. His LSO Mahler 6th from the 2000s isn't half bad, either.

The Mahler 3rd from Munich, which is less easy to get hold of:

https://www.amazon.de/Mahler-Symphonie-Nr-3-Doppel-CD/dp/B005WV7GNG/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1516781372&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=mahler+3+mariss+jansons

is also very fine (I bought it on the strength of, from memory, Petrushka's enthusiasm for the performance)

I also greatly like this performance:

https://www.amazon.de/Britten-Bavarian-Symphony-Orchestra-2013-09-05/dp/B01K8KOTDK/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1516781280&sr=1-1-fkmr0&keywords=britten+war+requiem+bavarian+radio+symphony+orchestra+mariss+jansons

As a generality, his recordings with the Bavarian RSO seem to bring out the best in him as opposed to those with the RCO (much more uneven: a flaccid Mahler 2nd but a very good Mahler 8th), although this is reputed to contain some very good performances (and some which are probably a bit, "ho hum"):

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mariss-Jansons-Radio-Recordings-1990-2014/product-reviews/B00VXZEXFO/ref=cm_cr_dp_d_btm?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&sortBy=recent#RO8RBIP0O4FSU

I haven't heard it but BBM for one has enthused about at least some of the performances elsewhere on the MB.

Last night I somewhat regretted being on an anti Jansons diatribe after my last post. I met him, briefly, when he started his Pittsburgh post. At the time he was a complete unknown to me, and we only chatted for a minute, but he charmed me with his “regular guy” personality, and it’s probably why Ihave continued to buy his recordings.
Fast forward 20 years and I am converting my CDs to a hard drive. The CDs that I really treasure I am keeping but the rest are being discarded after conversion. As I bring up the files by Conductor, it seems that I have over 2 dozen of them, most with the Concertgebouw or the Bavarians. I have not kept a single CD, except for a few that I haven’t converted. None of these recordings are outright bad (excepting his Mahler 3, which just doesn’t suit him), but they are mostly just ordinary, pleasant, generic...
When Bernstein, Karajan, Szell, Barbirolli, Klemperer, etc always we’re releasing recordings at the same frequency as MJ, they were events. Sometimes they could be spectacularly off base or willfully idiosyncratic, but there were many times that these were true epiphanies, records that at least while they were playing, make you say YES! This is how the music should go!
Obviously HD you don’t hear it as I do, and that’s ok. And there must be plenty of others who really like MJ or presumably
he wouldn’t have had the success that he has garnered. I admire MJ both as a Physician and now as a fellow patient with Coronary Artery Disease, and now that I can stream recordings before purchasing them, I won’t feel the resentment of buyers remorse.

[Stanfordian]

Last night I somewhat regretted being on an anti Jansons diatribe after my last post. I met him, briefly, when he started his Pittsburgh post. At the time he was a complete unknown to me, and we only chatted for a minute, but he charmed me with his “regular guy” personality, and it’s probably why Ihave continued to buy his recordings.
Fast forward 20 years and I am converting my CDs to a hard drive. The CDs that I really treasure I am keeping but the rest are being discarded after conversion. As I bring up the files by Conductor, it seems that I have over 2 dozen of them, most with the Concertgebouw or the Bavarians. I have not kept a single CD, except for a few that I haven’t converted. None of these recordings are outright bad (excepting his Mahler 3, which just doesn’t suit him), but they are mostly just ordinary, pleasant, generic...
When Bernstein, Karajan, Szell, Barbirolli, Klemperer, etc always we’re releasing recordings at the same frequency as MJ, they were events. Sometimes they could be spectacularly off base or willfully idiosyncratic, but there were many times that these were true epiphanies, records that at least while they were playing, make you say YES! This is how the music should go!
Obviously HD you don’t hear it as I do, and that’s ok. And there must be plenty of others who really like MJ or presumably
he wouldn’t have had the success that he has garnered. I admire MJ both as a Physician and now as a fellow patient with Coronary Artery Disease, and now that I can stream recordings before purchasing them, I won’t feel the resentment of buyers remorse.

Hiya richardfinegold,

This conductor bashing rather depresses me. It's certainly not my experience of Jansons. For eight years in the last decade in Munich I have attended Mariss Jansons concerts with the outstanding Symphonieorchester des Bayerischen Rundfunks and have always been inspired by his conducting.

[Alison]

Going back to Solti, has anyone heard his Mahler 5 with the Zurich Tonhalle?

His last ever concert?

[BBMmk2]

Going back to Solti, has anyone heard his Mahler 5 with the Zurich Tonhalle?

His last ever concert?

I didn't know he had recorded with them before? Was it like?

[richardfinegold]

Saturday Manfred Honeck is conducting the 5th in Chicago. I wonder if a recording is in the works

[HighlandDougie]

Saturday Manfred Honeck is conducting the 5th in Chicago. I wonder if a recording is in the works

I have this:

https://www.discogs.com/Mahler-Manfred-Honeck-Pittsburgh-Symphony-Orchestra-Symphony-No-5/release/9447029

which follows the usual Exton approach of 'warts-and-all' SACD recording but is the performance which made me sit up and notice Honeck. The Adagietto is a bit slow for my taste - and the brass sometimes over-dominate the musical texture - but it's worth a listen. A very good but, to my ears, not a great performance and, pace Richard, not in the same league as the Bavarian RSO and Jansons. It would be interesting if Reference Recordings made a new recording as the relationship of Honeck and his Pittsburghers has matured really well (another orchestra which makes its performances easily available - https://www.wqed.org/fm/pittsburgh-symphony-radio - well worth investigating).

[mahlerei]

I have this:

https://www.discogs.com/Mahler-Manfred-Honeck-Pittsburgh-Symphony-Orchestra-Symphony-No-5/release/9447029

which follows the usual Exton approach of 'warts-and-all' SACD recording but is the performance which made me sit up and notice Honeck. The Adagietto is a bit slow for my taste - and the brass sometimes over-dominate the musical texture - but it's worth a listen. A very good but, to my ears, not a great performance and, pace Richard, not in the same league as the Bavarian RSO and Jansons. It would be interesting if Reference Recordings made a new recording as the relationship of Honeck and his Pittsburghers has matured really well (another orchestra which makes its performances easily available - https://www.wqed.org/fm/pittsburgh-symphony-radio - well worth investigating).

HD

Yes, I agree about the Honeck M5, a very good performance but not a great one. Alas, I've not warmed to anything he's done since.

In case forumites don't know, the Reference FR series - the Honeck/PSO and Fischer/Utah albums - are recorded by Soundmirror and marketed by Reference; only the RR series is recorded by the company's in-house meister, Keith O. Johnson. The latter sound very impressive indeed.

[mahlerei]

Saturday Manfred Honeck is conducting the 5th in Chicago. I wonder if a recording is in the works

rfg

It's possible, I suppose, but Reference/Soundmirror are already committed to a Mahler cycle with Thierry Fischer and the Utah Symphony (Nos. 1 and 8 already recorded).

[richardfinegold]

I have this:

https://www.discogs.com/Mahler-Manfred-Honeck-Pittsburgh-Symphony-Orchestra-Symphony-No-5/release/9447029

which follows the usual Exton approach of 'warts-and-all' SACD recording but is the performance which made me sit up and notice Honeck. The Adagietto is a bit slow for my taste - and the brass sometimes over-dominate the musical texture - but it's worth a listen. A very good but, to my ears, not a great performance and, pace Richard, not in the same league as the Bavarian RSO and Jansons. It would be interesting if Reference Recordings made a new recording as the relationship of Honeck and his Pittsburghers has matured really well (another orchestra which makes its performances easily available - https://www.wqed.org/fm/pittsburgh-symphony-radio - well worth investigating).

Great! I thought that there was a Honeck First on Exton when I looked under recordings of the First didn't see it, so it must have been the Fifth. I've never bought an Exton recording but I have many SACD; what is the "warts and all" approach? (-

Just checked Amazon-there is a First, Third and Fourth on Exton--all pretty pricey

[HighlandDougie]

Great! I thought that there was a Honeck First on Exton when I looked under recordings of the First didn't see it, so it must have been the Fifth. I've never bought an Exton recording but I have many SACD; what is the "warts and all" approach? (-

Just checked Amazon-there is a First, Third and Fourth on Exton--all pretty pricey

Apologies! It's not an SACD but a CD - although still well-recorded. Exton are in the Mercury school of recording, as opposed to say, the Decca Phase Four school. A purist (and typically Japanese) approach where there is not much intervention by recording engineers, although I wouldn't want to suggest that they don't edit and master (and - usually - mix) what they record. Usually taken from live concerts but with patching sessions thereafter, the results reflect where they have been recorded so, if it's the Rudolfinum in Prague (Zdenek Mácal's Mahler 7 - a great favourite with Caliban, I remember) or the Concert Hall in Stockholm (Ashkenazy's Sibelius), the results are about as good as recordings ever get. If it's a more challenging recording venue, that's what you'll hear - no attempt to compensate for acoustic shortcomings. Hence my phrase about warts and all. My qualification about mixing is that they experiment with "One-Point" recording (see http://www.lcs-consulting-sales.de/en/technik_en.html which will give you the general idea). My one foray into it (Eliahu Inbal in the Mahler/Cooke 10th) was a good demonstration of, alas, every grunt and snort from Maestro Inbal (much worse than Colin Davis or Sir JB ). Anyway, this is a very rambling way of saying that, with Exton - and to mangle a phrase - "what you hear is what you get".