Bruckner

[Edgy 2]

Perhaps somebody could kindly produce and update a league table reflecting the latest recommendations for where to start one's Great Bruckner Trek?

Bear in mind that it's ok to not like Bruckner and move on,there's 'undreds of other composers

[Leinster Lass]

Bear in mind that it's ok to not like Bruckner and move on,there's 'undreds of other composers

League table suggestion just a bit of fun.
I'll desist.
Now.
Honest.

[cloughie]

... with Rudy Giuliani acting as arbitrator when disputes arise (which they will, I would think).
Re # 373 (just for the record) - I have heard all of Nos. 0, 4 and 6 to 9 more than once over the years and attended a performance of No. 4 in the Royal Festival Hall London many years ago.

You could always take the domino approach playing 5s & 3s!

[EnemyoftheStoat]

... with Rudy Giuliani acting as arbitrator when disputes arise (which they will, I would think).
Re # 373 (just for the record) - I have heard all of Nos. 0, 4 and 6 to 9 more than once over the years and attended a performance of No. 4 in the Royal Festival Hall London many years ago.

I was going to ask where you heard 0 but looking at your location, Dublin maybe? More likely to hear it there than at the RFH.

[jayne lee wilson]

Take 11 small pieces of paper or card, write the name of a symphony on each and then select your favourite hat, place the cards in the chosen hat and then draw one out and throw it away - do this ten times until there is one left - then with the last one - read it out and this symphony is the specially chosen one to start the AB journey. Listen and learn - any difficulties encountered, anything yo7 need to know - just ask Jayne!

The William S. Burroughs/David Bowie "cut-up" method of listening to Bruckner......
The Schalk Brothers legacy lives on....

[cloughie]

The William S. Burroughs/David Bowie "cut-up" method of listening to Bruckner......
The Schalk Brothers legacy lives on....

I suppose the other alternative would be to ask Alexa!

[LMcD]

According to Petroc, the lack of interest in Bruckner's 5th symphony led the composer to declare that he hated living in Vienna and couldn't wait to return to Linz, yet he died in the former and not the latter - how come?

[Petrushka]

According to Petroc, the lack of interest in Bruckner's 5th symphony led the composer to declare that he hated living in Vienna and couldn't wait to return to Linz, yet he died in the former and not the latter - how come?

We all say things we don't really mean when feeling down or depressed and composers are no exception. Elgar, for example, was notorious for his many statements about giving it all up, being useless as a composer etc. For Bruckner, returning to the provincial city of Linz would have been a gross admission of failure and all that we know of Bruckner testifies to his belief in his worth and in his music. I think he was well aware that he was largely composing for posterity.

20 years separate the 5th Symphony from Bruckner's death in 1896 and he would have realised that a return to Linz would have meant the end for his ambitions. Vienna was where he had to be to achieve anything at all. We should be glad he had the persistence and the faith to stick it out!

[LMcD]

During a guided tour of Vienna, as we stood listening more or less dutifully to the guide going on about 'The Kiss' yet again, I noticed a plaque on the building to our right which turned out to be Bruckner's last residence (in the Upper Belvedere). Our guide didn't mention this fact, nor did the names of any composers other than Mozart and Johann Strauss Junior cross her lips during our 3-day stay - or was Schubert briefly mentioned once in passing?

[Bryn]

During a guided tour of Vienna, as we stood listening more or less dutifully to the guide going on about 'The Kiss' yet again, I noticed a plaque on the building to our right which turned out to be Bruckner's last residence (in the Upper Belvedere). Our guide didn't mention this fact, nor did the names of any composers other than Mozart and Johann Strauss Junior cross her lips during our 3-day stay - or was Schubert briefly mentioned once in passing?

I hope you chided her regarding these gross omissions.

[LMcD]

I hope you chided her regarding these gross omissions.

'I'm sorry, but you will appreciate that I have to stick to the programme, my script and my schedule'.

[Ein Heldenleben]

We all say things we don't really mean when feeling down or depressed and composers are no exception. Elgar, for example, was notorious for his many statements about giving it all up, being useless as a composer etc. For Bruckner, returning to the provincial city of Linz would have been a gross admission of failure and all that we know of Bruckner testifies to his belief in his worth and in his music. I think he was well aware that he was largely composing for posterity.

20 years separate the 5th Symphony from Bruckner's death in 1896 and he would have realised that a return to Linz would have meant the end for his ambitions. Vienna was where he had to be to achieve anything at all. We should be glad he had the persistence and the faith to stick it out!

It’s often occurred to me that had Bruckner been aware of the industry that has sprung up around editing some of his symphonies he would have been staggered. He would also have been amazed at the number, variety and quality of performances of his work. I know he achieved some success during his lifetime but I wonder if we will ever again see a composer acquire such an extraordinary posthumous reputation. Either they don’t make them like that anymore of if they do we are better at recognising them.

[Bryn]

Not sure whether or not this has been the topic of discussion here before, but what of:

?

[jayne lee wilson]

It’s often occurred to me that had Bruckner been aware of the industry that has sprung up around editing some of his symphonies he would have been staggered. He would also have been amazed at the number, variety and quality of performances of his work. I know he achieved some success during his lifetime but I wonder if we will ever again see a composer acquire such an extraordinary posthumous reputation. Either they don’t make them like that anymore of if they do we are better at recognising them.

Bruckner was deeply concerned with and closely involved in (where external influences were operative) various symphonic revisions (and the complications, agonies and ecstasies, performance-practical and artistic, around them) all his life, but crucially bequeathed all the original version autographs of his symphonies to the Austrian National Library; a far-seeing artist ahead of his time, maybe he would not be all that surprised at their latter history.

He died in 1896. The increased interest in his music gained momentum during and after the first serious attempts to establish authenticity in the scores, by Haas in the 1930s. Following Haas' postwar discreditation, Leopold Nowak took the work on, and many conductors (Bohm, Furtwangler, Kna etc), already performing Bruckner devotedly pre-war, played them and recorded them increasingly often. So the wait was well under 50 years. No that long for Great Art, really...
(There is often a lull in interest after a great artist's death...Consider Tippett or Robert Simpson today...)

In fact, Mozart(**) had to wait rather longer - broadly till the 1930s - for a full appreciation of his genius, as although recognised as a master-composer at the time of his death, during the Romantic century his music was considered - yes, beautiful, but rather too delicate and gentle. Beethoven was of course the overwhelming cultural spiritus loci, even if the Late Quartets remained baffling to many, for decades afterward.

(**) Just begun Jan Swafford's magisterial (cliché, but there's no other word...) Mozart biography - very highly recommended!).

[Bryn]

Any views here on Eichhorn's Bruckner? I have just imported from QOBUZ those he recorded. The completion of the 9th included is not, of course, the most recent Samale et al. What am I letting myself in for?